Just take the topic subject, and say it real loud. Gol' Durn! TCs take a whole insert pig reference lot of work!

I decided, after crafting a few systems, that the above statement is indeed misleading. TCs take a whole censored------------------------------------censored--------------------------------------censored-----------------------------------------------censored----------------------star ting-to-sound-like-the-Jerry-Springer-show-censored----------------------- lot of work.

I thought laying out and naming 450 something systems would be the hardest part of the plug. Man was I wrong. Now, I have to go back, and fill out each system, one by one, trying to make each one unique in some way. And to add to my fun, ALL of the non-empty NGC-type systems (About 1/2) change hands at some point in some mission string. SO, I get to create two versions of these, complete with a different set of DUDE's, PERS's, and planetary descriptions. Plus, even in the uninhabited regions, there are 10 moving satellites, that jump around between at least 4 systems each, so there's another 40 systems, plus 40 crons. Now, the missions. There will probably be a mission for every system involving the change of hands, and with my setting, these will be massive fleet battles, so I'll need a few missions each to get all the special ships right.... And.... ugh. Brain numb...

I posted this thread/rant in the hopes of giving other TC makers a place to vent when the workload starts looking like a Mt. Everest from base camp. Also, any would be TC makers would do well to read this, so they know what they are getting into. Maybe I can help keep vaporware from starting.... People, making outfits and weapons and ships is fun. The rest isn't. Save those for last, they can wait.

------------------
~Charlie

Welcome to plug-in development

Now you know why so many TC's turn to vaporware.

------------------
I used to jog but the ice kept falling out of my glass.

May I also suggest ,(url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/cgi-bin/ubb/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&forum;=EV+banter+|AMP|+brawl&number;=10&DaysPrune;=20&LastLogin;=")EV banter and brawl forum (/url)

And to reply to your topic :

It takes alot of work indeed. Don't give up,

Good luck with it,

Entarus,

------------------
(url="http://"http://www.apple.com")iMac, Therefore, I am(/url)
(url="http://"http://www.ariossoftware.com/upcoming/")EVONE 1.0.0, the plugin editor for EV/EVO/EVN(/url)
Somewhere out there life is bound to exist...

Oh, I've been doing plugs since EV was released. All abandoned. I knew what I was getting into. But it still helps to have a place to bitch about it. At this point, I have way to much time, energy, and thought invested to give up- but more and more stuff jsut keeps showing up. I used to say, "I can go back and mess with the Visbits/display orders/whatever later, it won't take long". Now I say, "Bloody hell, do it now, you wanker". Well, off to write more DESC's... Hi-ho, hi-ho, its off to work I go, la la la la la....

CENSORED S˙st resources! Now I have to do ALL of their hyperlinks!

But--- ALL BASE STAR SYSTEMS HAVE BEEN MAPPED! WOO HOO!

------------------
Benarhtalh engan. >^_^<
(url="http://"http://WWW.Ninjaburger.com")Ninjaburger.(/url) There in 30 minutes or we commit seppuku.
A Stoir Moi Chroi. A plugin for EVN. "And Druid's feet will pace again/the mountians of my childhood..."

Duh, of course TC are frikken hard. Thats why their so cool to make.

------------------
"...yet gradually we recovered, venturing cautiously back into the void of space afraid of what we might find there."

No kidding. "The Resurgence" is pretty small by TC standards, having only around 60 systems, but it's still taking <pork>ing ages.

------------------
(url="http://"http://www.mazca.com/")Mazca(/url) , Moderator, (url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/cgi-bin/ubb/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&number;=9&SUBMIT;=Go&urgaylol;=yes")EV Developer's Corner(/url)
"I expect you'd like to know about frogmen?"

In the kindest way, I respond... 'duh!'

Many people start with maps and systems... that seems the lengthiest but most straightforward section to work on.

In reality, most of the work is (or should be) missions, followed by equipment and ships. Debugging and testing (if people bother) consumes a vast amount of time.

But graphics and creating systems is quicker and more fun, so...

This is why many TCs get a map, graphics, then screech to a halt.

Given that most people who try this are just young enough not to realize the problems or make money off of their creativity, it's also not surprising most TCs fail.

(I, on the other hand, am just old enough to want to get paid for my long hours to consider TCs wistfully and move on)

------------------
When I am working on a problem I never think about beauty. I only think about how to solve the problem. But when I have finished, if the solution is not beautiful, I
know it is wrong.
- Buckminster Fuller (1895-1983)

Quote

Originally posted by wtimmins:
**In the kindest way, I respond... 'duh!'

Many people start with maps and systems... that seems the lengthiest but most straightforward section to work on.

In reality, most of the work is (or should be) missions, followed by equipment and ships. Debugging and testing (if people bother) consumes a vast amount of time.

But graphics and creating systems is quicker and more fun, so...

This is why many TCs get a map, graphics, then screech to a halt.

Given that most people who try this are just young enough not to realize the problems or make money off of their creativity, it's also not surprising most TCs fail.

(I, on the other hand, am just old enough to want to get paid for my long hours to consider TCs wistfully and move on)

**

Actually, making Systs is the hardest part for me. I need to make the systs, planets, ships, weaps, dudes, and outfits before I do the missions. But the missions are drawn out pretty much. I just need to get a good mission programmer.

Besides, I think the world defines the story...

------------------
Benarhtalh engan. >^_^<
(url="http://"http://WWW.Ninjaburger.com")Ninjaburger.(/url) There in 30 minutes or we commit seppuku.
A Stoir Moi Chroi. A plugin for EVN. "And Druid's feet will pace again/the mountians of my childhood..."

Maps and Systems: Straightforward, maybe. Fun, no.
Graphics: I guess if you do graphics for a living it's quick. My graphics guy takes bloody ages! (But he's as busy as me and does damn good looking stuff)

More rant:
Systems, systems, all the bloody systems. I go down the list, copying the same düde and përs layout for many systems. Should I feel bad about this? Do I have an obligation to make each system unique in some way? I hope not. Do I really care how long the fleet takes to respond? Yes, but man... trying to make it consistent with the centers of power... And lets not even get into laying out an economy. Someone needs to make a tool that aids in this, automates it even. Just go through the web of systems, find the spöbs, and lay out not-to-lucrative trade routes. But is it worth it in my plug? Not really, as we still haven't decided if there is even going to be a Trader-type character. Do people on a mission string really care? I don't, but some people get their Zen time trading...

Just ignore them.
Those people don't need a TC.

------------------

Quote

Originally posted by Masamune:
Someone needs to make a tool that aids in this, automates it even. Just go through the web of systems, find the spöbs, and lay out not-to-lucrative trade routes. But is it worth it in my plug?

TomWoozle was working on such a tool. It was called (url="http://"http://www.ambrosiasw.com/webboard/Forum9/HTML/001810.htm")Systematic(/url) and it did really look like it was coming along well but somehow TomWoozle has become of quite rare sight on the webboards. I believe he doesn't have access to a Mac too often, either.

Last time I spoke to him he was working on an EV: Classic TC for the Nova scenario but I don't remember all the details. Soviet Mikee, who seems to be well-informed about the Port Authority project (see topic on the Nova board as well as the on this board), in which I believe Tom was/is involved in too could probably give you more info. Or maybe not.

------------------
Pez's Profile Refresh no. 15
Storm Bolt: 75 mana.Thunder Clap: 90 mana. Avatar: 125 mana. (url="http://"http://www.battle.net/war3/basics/herokillers.shtml")Owning their three heroes(/url) with your micro skills: priceless.
Some things just can't be finished with spells, for everything else, there's the (url="http://"http://www.battle.net/war3/human/units/mountainking.shtml")Mountain King(/url).

Quote

Originally posted by Masamune:
Just go through the web of systems, find the spöbs, and lay out not-to-lucrative trade routes.

I don't know about laying out the trade route, but some while ago I wrote (url="http://"http://w1.182.telia.com/~u18219788/")EV Map(/url), mostly for my own benefit. It's a utility to figure out which trade routes are the best in a scenario or plugin. It can also display information on where stuff is cheap and pricy in the main map - it might help you.

Kidglove

------------------
Compilers - the ultimate god games.