Well, this is development related, but since it directly concerns the (url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/webboard/Forum6/HTML/001571.html#")Battle for Sol(/url) thread on this board, I think it fits OK here.

Anyway, I'm working on a plug to add all the ships invented for the Battle for Sol thread to the Universe. They may be for purchase only, or possibly show up later in the game, I'm not sure yet. I'm also considering doing missions that roughly follow the plot as laid out in the thread, which would come after the alien missions for each side. The main reason I'm posting this now is that I'm going to need some stats and graphics from those of you who have made some ships. I'm going to need graphics for the following if this is going to work:

modified Rebel Manta(if you have them, Skyblade, otherwise I'll just use the standard graphics)
Rebel Star Cobra
Rebel Starscreamer
Komodo Armored Frigate

I also need permission from David Arthur to use the graphics to the Rebel Firefox from your Talon plug, since those were usd here. I'll be using the Kestrel graphics for the Osprey, David, if you have something better you want me to use, let me know.

Also, at this point I'll be using Proton weapons instead of the Turbolasers. Captain Skyblade, since I think you invented them, if you could post stats for them here, I'll switch to those.

Also, since I have little in the way of good graphics applications, it would be helpful if someone who does could do the rotation on the graphics for my ships. I'll be doing the 0° angle for my ships, but if someone else could rotate and compile that into the 36 part sprite, that would be helpful(if not, I'll try it on my own, I guess). I can make my own masks easily enough, but don't have any real way to do the rotations well.

I'm going to need some help from the rest of you in the thread to do this, so I'm hoping you will. If not, that's OK, but I'd really appreciate any help on this. So if you could post comments and/or full statistics for your ships you've done here, that would be just great.

------------------
Almost doesn't count, but barely does.
"The problem with the designated driver program, it's not a desirable job. But if you ever get sucked into doing it, have fun with it. At the end of the night, drop them off at the wrong house."
- Jeff Foxworthy

(This message has been edited by Macavenger (edited 07-15-2001).)

Quote

Originally posted by Macavenger:
I also need permission from David Arthur to use the graphics to the Rebel Firefox from your Talon plug, since those were usd here. I'll be using the Kestrel graphics for the Osprey, David, if you have something better you want me to use, let me know.

Give me a couple of days and I'll put together a package of the Osprey, Firefox, abd the latest versions of the other Confederate ships for you.

------------------
David Arthur
(url="http://"http://members.aol.com/darthur1/talon-ev/")Talon Plugin for the original Escape Velocity(/url)

(This message has been edited by David Arthur (edited 07-15-2001).)

Thanks, David. You can e-mail them to me when you get done, or upload them somewhere and give me a link whatever. The package comes with full stats for all of them, right? I know some of the Ospreys weapons and stuff, but not all of it.

------------------
Almost doesn't count, but barely does.
"The problem with the designated driver program, it's not a desirable job. But if you ever get sucked into doing it, have fun with it. At the end of the night, drop them off at the wrong house."
- Jeff Foxworthy

Quote

Originally posted by Macavenger:
Thanks, David. You can e-mail them to me when you get done, or upload them somewhere and give me a link whatever. The package comes with full stats for all of them, right? I know some of the Ospreys weapons and stuff, but not all of it.

If it's all right with you, I'd like to put together my ships as a complete plugin of their own which you can then package with the other vessels. I've figured out which resources I need, so if you could tell me which ID#s are appropriate to ensure that our work doesn't conflict, it would be helpful.

• 6 shďp resources (2 new classes of cruiser, 1 new class of frigate, 3 classes of Osprey)

• 1 wëap resource (turreted particle beam)

• 3 oütf resources (turreted particle beam, gunboat, and bay)

------------------
David Arthur
(url="http://"http://members.aol.com/darthur1/talon-ev/")Talon Plugin for the original Escape Velocity(/url)

Quote

Originally posted by David Arthur:
**If it's all right with you, I'd like to put together my ships as a complete plugin of their own which you can then package with the other vessels. I've figured out which resources I need, so if you could tell me which ID#s are appropriate to ensure that our work doesn't conflict, it would be helpful.

• 6 shďp resources (2 new classes of cruiser, 1 new class of frigate, 3 classes of Osprey)

• 1 wëap resource (turreted particle beam)

• 3 oütf resources (turreted particle beam, gunboat, and bay)

**

That works too. You can have shďp IDs 156 through 161, wëap ID 155, and oütf IDs 186 through 188.
I was planning to reduce the fuel costs of the P. Beam and Turret somewhat, if you don't mind my doing that. The way technology is advancing in this, I though that would be fair.
Also, for now at least, I'm using your Fusion Beam outfit graphics that came with Talon; if you don't want those in the final plug, let me know and I'll come up with something else. They're so good that I don't think I could do any better.

------------------
Almost doesn't count, but barely does.
"The problem with the designated driver program, it's not a desirable job. But if you ever get sucked into doing it, have fun with it. At the end of the night, drop them off at the wrong house."
- Jeff Foxworthy

Here goes for the Starscreamer and Komodo:

Starscreamer (concept from Empire II's Tactical Bomber)

3 Turbolasers, 1 Guided Bomb Rack and 10 Precision Bombs, 1 Rocket Pod and
5 Heavy Rockets. 35 Shields, 5 Armor. Speed: 400; Accel: 300; Turning: 150

Komodo Armored Frigate

6 Turbolaser Turrets, 3 Guided Bomb Racks and 35 Precision Bombs, 2 Bomb Racks and 15 Space Bombs, Compressor Beam, 1 Firefox Bay and 4 Firefoxes.
110 Shields, 550 Armor. Speed: 225; Accel: 150; Turning: 60

I'm not to good in the way of graphics, sorry.

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If we're "talented" the world is doomed.

Well, from some of Capt. Skyblade's posts in the original topic, he might be. If he can't do them, maybe I'll post an ad on the dev board sometime. Can you guve me a general idea or sketch or something of what they look like? For the ships, do you have ideas for things like Cost, ShieldRe, Holds, FreeMass, any of those, or do I get to make those up? I also need some idea on how Turbolasers and Precision Bombs work. I've got the impression that precision bombs are guided, not freefall bombs, bt I'm not sure there.

Oh, and David, I don't know if you still want to redo the Firefox, but right now I'm using shďp ID# 162 for it, so if you do, you could use that ID.

------------------
Almost doesn't count, but barely does.
"The problem with the designated driver program, it's not a desirable job. But if you ever get sucked into doing it, have fun with it. At the end of the night, drop them off at the wrong house."
- Jeff Foxworthy

(This message has been edited by Macavenger (edited 07-16-2001).)

Quote

Originally posted by Macavenger:
I was planning to reduce the fuel costs of the P. Beam and Turret somewhat, if you don't mind my doing that. The way technology is advancing in this, I though that would be fair.

Yes, I was planning to do that too. After all, the version you get in standard EV is a prototype that the Confederation is willing to give away to an independent captain, whereas this one is one that's gone into standard service on navy vessels.

Quote

Originally posted by Macavenger:
Also, for now at least, I'm using your Fusion Beam outfit graphics that came with Talon...

The fusion beam and seeker drone graphics aren't mine; they're from the alien outfits package in the free graphics section of (url="http://"http://www.grand-novice.com/")Matthew Dailey's site(/url), so you're allowed to use them as long as "Matthew Dailey and the URL for my homepage (url="http://"http://www.grand-novice.com")http://www.grand-novice.com(/url) appears in the ReadMe for your plug and/or in any area on your site were credits are listed."

I'll include the Firefox in my package as well.

------------------
David Arthur
(url="http://"http://members.aol.com/darthur1/talon-ev/")Talon Plugin for the original Escape Velocity(/url)

I've put up a candidate plugin (url="http://"http://members.aol.com/DArthur1/battleforsol.hqx")here(/url). It still needs a little tweaking before it's ready for release - the particle beam weapons in particular - but it should give you an idea of what I'll be sending you. I've put in all my ships and weapons, and modified some düde, përs, and flët resources to make some of the ships appear. Note that I haven't done this for the Firefox, so if you want there to be AI Firefoxes flying around, you'll need to modify the resources yourself in your own plugin.

Again, this isn't a final version of the plugin. That will be available in a day or two at most.

------------------
David Arthur
(url="http://"http://members.aol.com/darthur1/talon-ev/")Talon Plugin for the original Escape Velocity(/url)

So, do you want to release these separately? I'd always planned on making them into a single plug, but we can do a Confederate plug and a Rebel Plug if you want. I'd like to do the final release at the same time if we're doing separate ones though.
One other thing, since the Firefox is going to be carried on a couple of ships, and since carried fighters for the player appear to get only half their ammo, rounded down, I'm going to give the Firefox an extra Heavy Rocket and maybe another Torpedo. That shouldn't unbalance it significantly, but will make it much more useful as a carried fighter to the player.

------------------
Almost doesn't count, but barely does.
"The problem with the designated driver program, it's not a desirable job. But if you ever get sucked into doing it, have fun with it. At the end of the night, drop them off at the wrong house."
- Jeff Foxworthy

Quote

Originally posted by Macavenger:
So, do you want to release these separately?

I wasn't thinking of my work as a plugin to release separately, I just would rather my resources stayed in a plugin of my own for various reasons. I assumed the idea was to package both of our work in one archive, so when someone downloaded the Battle for Sol package, they'd get both your plugin and mine.

Quote

Originally posted by Macavenger:
... give the Firefox an extra Heavy Rocket and maybe another Torpedo.

I'll put that into the plugin, and I should be able to get the final candidate to you tomorrow.

------------------
David Arthur
(url="http://"http://members.aol.com/darthur1/talon-ev/")Talon Plugin for the original Escape Velocity(/url)

However you want to do the release is OK with me I guess. I had originally planned on combining all the resources from both into one plug, and having all of us in the credits part of the ReadMe. But if you want to do your part as one plug and my part as another and put them in the same archive, that works too.

------------------
Almost doesn't count, but barely does.
"The problem with the designated driver program, it's not a desirable job. But if you ever get sucked into doing it, have fun with it. At the end of the night, drop them off at the wrong house."
- Jeff Foxworthy

Okay. I've put a new copy of the plugin (url="http://"http://members.aol.com/DArthur1/battleforsol.hqx")here(/url). This one is releaseable unless you have any problems.

------------------
David Arthur
(url="http://"http://members.aol.com/darthur1/talon-ev/")Talon Plugin for the original Escape Velocity(/url)

Only Skyblade really knows what turbolasers are. Precision bombs are lighter guided space bombs: very powerful. You could make up some realistic figures for the other categories.

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If we're "talented" the world is doomed.

OK, I can handle the prcision bombs, but how about your ships, I need some idea of what they look like. A top-down approximate Appleworks sketch would be fine, or just a description along the lines of "think this ship from this sci-fi deal, but take off the fins and add..." you know, something like that. I gotta have some idea here.

------------------
Almost doesn't count, but barely does.
"The problem with the designated driver program, it's not a desirable job. But if you ever get sucked into doing it, have fun with it. At the end of the night, drop them off at the wrong house."
- Jeff Foxworthy

Quote

Originally posted by David Arthur:
**Okay. I've put a new copy of the plugin here. This one is releaseable unless you have any problems.
**

First problem: I can't seem to download it. I get a "Sorry, we can't find that page." message. Check your link.

------------------
Almost doesn't count, but barely does.
"The problem with the designated driver program, it's not a desirable job. But if you ever get sucked into doing it, have fun with it. At the end of the night, drop them off at the wrong house."
- Jeff Foxworthy

Quote

Originally posted by Macavenger:
First problem: I can't seem to download it. I get a "Sorry, we can't find that page." message. Check your link.

Well, for some reason our friends at America Offline saw fit to delete the archive. I've re-uploaded it, and the link now works for me. Try it; if it still doesn't work, let me know and I'll email it to you.

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David Arthur
(url="http://"http://members.aol.com/darthur1/talon-ev/")Talon Plugin for the original Escape Velocity(/url)

OK, a few thoughts:

I think first we need to settle exactly how we want to do the release process. Obviously, it's going to be one archive file. Now, my personal preference would be to put all the resources from both of our plugs into one and give credits as appropriate. Second choice would be to have a Confed and a Rebel file, which would move the Firefox to my half, though of course I would still give you proper credit for it. If you want to, we can do it with your part as it is now, but this isn't really my preference.

A few of suggestions on what you've given me:

• For the P. Beams, you have the Cannon using 2 fuel and the Turret using 1. I think they should probably be the same, and 2 fuel would be my choice there.

• The düde resources you've altered to include some new Confed technology. This works fine, but we'd have to have people install it after they beat the Alien mission this way, which would get a little weird because of the change in the Confed naming scheme(which I like your style better). Might not be an ideal solution here, but it's something to think about.

• I'd also like to make some modifications to the Firefox descriptions, since after using it in ship based form a little I've come to think of it more as a tactical bomber than a medium fighter, especially with more ammo. Here's my thoughts on the ship description:

As the number of sympathetic corporations grew, the Rebellion was able to commission a new starfighter to complement the Manta, which is outdated by any standards. The result was the F-41A Firefox tactical bomber. Powered by twin MN-004 engines, and boasting substantial advances in shields and armament, this new part of the Rebel fleet is more than a match for the Confederate policeships and gunboats, and is even better suited to assaulting capital ships.
For the hiring, just change medium fighter to tactical bomber. I'll be doing the dëscs for the fighter outfit in any case, which will be similar to above.

Well, that's all I found for now.

------------------
Almost doesn't count, but barely does.
"The problem with the designated driver program, it's not a desirable job. But if you ever get sucked into doing it, have fun with it. At the end of the night, drop them off at the wrong house."
- Jeff Foxworthy

Quote

Originally posted by Macavenger:
Now, my personal preference would be to put all the resources from both of our plugs into one and give credits as appropriate.

I suppose this is all right, provided that all the credits, web links, and legal stuff from my readme file remain intact.

Quote

Originally posted by Macavenger:
For the P. Beams, you have the Cannon using 2 fuel and the Turret using 1. I think they should probably be the same, and 2 fuel would be my choice there.

If you read the dësc resources, you'll see that it says that the turret is more fuel efficient because of a redesign, but if this is a problem I can make them both use 2 fuel.

Quote

Originally posted by Macavenger:
The düde resources you've altered to include some new Confed technology. This works fine, but we'd have to have people install it after they beat the Alien mission this way, which would get a little weird because of the change in the Confed naming scheme(which I like your style better).

I'm not really sure why we'd have to have people install it after completing the alien mission. In Battle for Sol, we've never discussed the alien mission, so I've always assumed that the alien cruiser hasn't been detected yet.

As for the Conferate naming scheme, I just don't like calling their ships "U.S.S." It makes me think too much of both the United States and Star Trek. It seems to me the ships of the Confederation should be named in a more unique way.

Quote

Originally posted by Macavenger:
I'd also like to make some modifications to the Firefox descriptions, since after using it in ship based form a little I've come to think of it more as a tactical bomber than a medium fighter, especially with more ammo.

The Firefox was originally designed as a medium fighter, but I'll modify the resources to indicate its use as a tactical bomber. I'll have a new release candidate ready for you soon.

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David Arthur
(url="http://"http://members.aol.com/darthur1/talon-ev/")Talon Plugin for the original Escape Velocity(/url)

(This message has been edited by David Arthur (edited 07-19-2001).)

Quote

Originally posted by David Arthur:
I'm not really sure why we'd have to have people install it after completing the alien mission. In Battle for Sol, we've never discussed the alien mission, so I've always assumed that the alien cruiser hasn't been detected yet.

Well, I noticed that the original Confed Cruiser seems to be gone from all the düde resources in yours, so I assumed this was supposed to be a later in the game, as technology advances thing. However, this could work pretty good if I end up writing missions for both sides, which might even replace the alien missions.

Quote

Originally posted by David Arthur:
As for the Conferate naming scheme, I just don't like calling their ships "U.S.S." It makes me think too much of both the United States and Star Trek. It seems to me the ships of the Confederation should be named in a more unique way.

I agree.

Quote

Originally posted by David Arthur:
If you read the dësc resources, you'll see that it says that the turret is more fuel efficient because of a redesign, but if this is a problem I can make them both use 2 fuel.

OK, that works then. I guess you've just thought all this stuff out on slightly different lines than I have.

------------------
Almost doesn't count, but barely does.
"The problem with the designated driver program, it's not a desirable job. But if you ever get sucked into doing it, have fun with it. At the end of the night, drop them off at the wrong house."
- Jeff Foxworthy