Light Freighter or Argosy? What do you think?
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Freighter Poll
9 19 315
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For transporting an uncontroversial load of cargo through the Core Worlds with the caps lock key on, the Light Freighter is better. For any other purpose, only an Argosy is acceptable.
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David Arthur
(url="http://"http://members.aol.com/darthur1/talon-ev/")Talon Plugin for Classic EV(/url) -
Argosy of course. The LF is just too keech for words, except if you like plodding round the inner Confed worlds and being afraid of defenders.
The argosy has- a cooler name
- is a bit faster and manuevarable
- And can have 2 turrets
- doesn't look like a giant space sausage
- it has cooler fins on it's butt, too. Tho ya don't need them in space...
You can do all the missions in the argosy, too, short of the first UGE mission and maybe the alien missions. Someone once said they got quite far in a LF, though, with all the upgrades.
I usually get a courier - with a missile rack and 3 missiles, you're in a lightning within 10 minutes, and can trade-in for a better ship quickly enough.
martin
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mner, mner, mner -
hahahaha. Light freighter is a Bulk Freighter with less cargo space. A shuttle with a single laser cannon can take them out. The argosy, if used correctly, can take on corvettes.
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Originally posted by martin:
Tho ya don't need them in space...However, since ships in EV land on a regular basis, they still serve a purpose.
I feel I must point out that it doesn't seem meaningful to say that either the AS-129 or the Argosy is "better" than the other; they are designed (and used) for different purposes, and each is better than the other in its own way.
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David Arthur
(url="http://"http://members.aol.com/darthur1/talon-ev/")Talon Plugin for Classic EV(/url) -
The man has a good point there. I guess if the design specs don't have "defensability" in them, you won't put that in. I guess, though, if you're playing EV, you won't stick with freightering about forever... Or will you?
And yes, he's right about the fins.
martin
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mner, mner, mner -
Argosy, really nothing to debate here. if I want to go around the core worlds with caps lock on, I'll steal a BF. And Actually, if you use it right, and Argosy can not only take a Corvette, it can beat up a Kestral.
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Originally posted by Macavenger:
if I want to go around the core worlds with caps lock on, I'll steal a BF......and the Core Worlds will really like you for that, won't they?
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Originally posted by Macavenger:
if you use it right, and (sic) Argosy can not only take a Corvette, it can beat up a Kestral.Naturally.
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David Arthur
(url="http://"http://members.aol.com/darthur1/talon-ev/")Talon Plugin for Classic EV(/url) -
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**...and the Core Worlds will really like you for that, won't they?:)
**Another good point. You have to be on pretty good terms with the Confeds of the core to get away with stealing a Bulk Freighter.
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Disabling and capturing a bulk freighter won't make the confederacy hate you so much, and as all cargo routes the light one can take could be took by the bulk one, I vote for the Bulk Freighter, the better cargo-carrying ship. The light freighter is just useful when you do not have the money to buy an argosy or if you lack the money and/or skills and/or "dare to do it" to buy a fighter (and take some escorts for crew) and capture a bulk Freighter.
At last, I don't see in which purpose the LF is better than the Argosy. 20 tons of cargo? Buy two mass expansions. Cheaper? OK, let's compare the shuttle and the Kestrel. Well, the shuttle is better because it is cheaper :D.
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M'enfin!
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Originally posted by Zacha Pedro:
OK, let's compare the shuttle and the Kestrel. Well, the shuttle is better because it is cheaper.Exactly. It's all a matter of purpose. If all you're going to be doing is carrying passengers around the Core Worlds, a shuttlecraft is indeed better than the Kestrel because it is not only cheaper, but faster and more maneuverable as well. Similarly, if you don't need a ship that can fight or withstand being fought, a light freighter ~is~ better than an Argosy, because it carries more cargo for a lower price.
While I agree that the bulk freighter is more effective than the light freighter, please note that the original question in this thread asked us to choose only between the light freighter and Argosy. As well, since the bulk freighter can only be obtained by disabling and capturing one, it is a bit riskier, even if it doesn't bring you below the Confederate crime tolerance.
Don't get me wrong. I like the Argosy, and often spend a considerable amount of time in one, whereas I very rarely fly a light (or bulk) freighter. It's just that I don't think you can say that one is 'better' than the other without qualification any more than you can say an armoured personnel carrier is 'better' than a transport truck.
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David Arthur
(url="http://"http://members.aol.com/darthur1/talon-ev/")Talon Plugin for Classic EV(/url)(This message has been edited by David Arthur (edited 07-14-2001).)
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OK, so let's make some clarifications:
-on polls, the price of the ship won't be important: it is just the number of ships you must plunder, er I mean the quantity of cargo you must carry to buy it
-on future polls, the starter must specify in what extent we must explain one is better than another.I mean: the price isn't important because we want to compare what you can do, how long you will survive, what cargo you can carry or how much 'fed ships you will be able to kill with the ship in your hands.
If we talked about the bulk freighter, that's because the title of the topic is "freighter poll". It is only in the first message that we are said we must decide whether Argosy or AS-129 is better, and we don't look at it every time. Furthermore talking only of the 2 is a bit restrictive: we could talk of other cargo ships, including confed frigates that we have converted into cargo haulers :D. And at last I would like to say the AS-129 only exists because the feds didn't want to make the BF sold to everybody.------------------
M'enfin!
Y'a personne qui parle français ici? -
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Originally posted by Zacha Pedro:
... the price isn't important because we want to compare what you can do, how long you will survive, what cargo you can carry or how much 'fed (or rebel -ed.) ships you will be able to kill with the ship in your hands.When was this ever stated? It seems to me that the price is an important factor in a ship's value, since (for example) it's a waste of time to stay in a shuttlecraft/scoutship/whatever long enough to afford an Argosy if a light freighter will do the job.
However, if you're only interested in which ship more worth stealing, or which ship would be appropriate in a communist society where you don't have to pay for anything, do the math. An Argosy carries 130 tons of cargo, which can be expanded to 160 tons using cargo pods. An AS129 carries 150 tons, expandable to 170 tons. If you don't need the Argosy's speed and safety, the AS129 carries 10 tons more cargo, and I still think it's significant that the AS129 - after applying the cargo pods mentioned above - costs 477,500 credits less than the upgraded Argosy. That's 20 less rush deliveries.
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Originally posted by Zacha Pedro:
Furthermore talking only of the 2 is a bit restrictive: we could talk of other cargo ships, including confed frigates that we have converted into cargo haulers.However, that's not the purpose of this poll. As far as I can tell, when Luke originally posted, it was because he wanted to know whether people preferred the AS-129 or the Argosy, not about frigates and bulk freighters.
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Originally posted by Zacha Pedro:
And at last I would like to say the AS-129 only exists because the feds didn't want to make the BF sold to everybody.The AS1300 isn't particularly a Confederate ship any more than the AS129 - there's plenty of independent ones, and even a few Rebel ones. I don't know why Matt Burch didn't make it available in shipyards, but it doesn't seem to be because of any Confederate intervention. All the description resource says about the AS1300 is:
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The Allied Shipyards AS1300 is the best - indeed, the only - bulk freighter available. Their high cost and weak defenses preclude their use in the frontier systems, but further in, these huge ships carry the majority of commerce between the Core Worlds.
Further, the real reason the AS129 exists falls back to the price issue, which, although you have discounted it, is important to maintaining a realistic scenario. If the AS1300 was available in shipyards, it would probably be significantly more expensive than the AS129.
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David Arthur
(url="http://"http://members.aol.com/darthur1/talon-ev/")Talon Plugin for the original Escape Velocity(/url)(This message has been edited by David Arthur (edited 07-15-2001).)
