I've seen some scattered postings comparing Avara.com to Avara.org. Is there no value to a unified and official Avara website? What with Avara.com, Avara.org, and Avara.net all trying to be official Avara sites, news is spread pretty thin in a community that doesn't produce too much excitement as it is. What do you guys think?

PatH
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Web: (url="http://"http://play.at/avara")http://play.at/avara(/url)

"Warning: Cape Does Not Allow User To Fly."
-Batman Costume Warning Label

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"Warning: Cape does
not allow user to fly."
-Batman Costume
Warning Label

Quote

Originally posted by PatH:
**I've seen some scattered postings comparing Avara.com to Avara.org. Is there no value to a unified and official Avara website? What with Avara.com, Avara.org, and Avara.net all trying to be official Avara sites, news is spread pretty thin in a community that doesn't produce too much excitement as it is. What do you guys think?

**

That was my hope, and the reason why I made the people who run Avara.net and Avara.org admins here -- but it doesn't seem like it is going to happen, for whatever reason.

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Andrew Welch / el Presidente / Ambrosia Software, Inc.
(url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/~andrew/")http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/~andrew/(/url)

That's too bad. I think that a unified Avara site would be an improvement over the current situation. Although we would need some deticated people to run it, we have those already in the Avara.org and Avara.net sites. I think that bringing the best Avara people together to work on one net site would benefit the community greatly, and possibly be able to provide community-enhancing features such as the so-called Avara Player Index and a ratings system.

PatH

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Web: [http://play.at/avara
"Warning:](http://play.at/avara<br />
) Cape does
not allow user to fly."

Heck, I'd love to see a uber-site and not all this silliness with a 3 prong approach. However, I feel I'm justified in my blasé about the whole Avara thing, after seeing and trying so many attempts to help the game in so many different ways and the results going nowhere.

There's just not an audience anymore, even when I personally still find the game the most enduring piece of computer gaming ever made.

If I was still really hyped about the Avara thing, I'd do one of three things:

- Find some sort of no bulls--t programmer to do something with the source code

- Lobby Ben Spees to consider an Avaragnarok

- Ask Andrew for permission to replace the extremely blah Avara.com page.

I checked out the Avara.org forums.. there seems to be some sort of incommunicado between Juri and Ambrosia..?

Yes...it's over the Ambrosia web boards too, I think on Ambrosia Banter or something...

PatH

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Web: [http://play.at/avara
"Warning:](http://play.at/avara<br />
) Cape does
not allow user to fly."

Quote

Originally posted by DeathGuru:
**
- Find some sort of no bulls--t programmer to do something with the source code

- Lobby Ben Spees to consider an Avaragnarok

- Ask Andrew for permission to replace the extremely blah Avara.com page.

I checked out the Avara.org forums.. there seems to be some sort of incommunicado between Juri and Ambrosia..?**

Finding someone to do something with the source code would be a good idea, though as I've pointed out before, I doubt many people who knew what they were doing would use the Avara source code as the basis for Avara 2, other than for reference.

Lobbying Ben isn't a good idea, he's very busy with what he's working on.

As for the "extremely blah" avara.com page, if you could clarify exactly what you don't like about it, that'd make a heck of a lot more sense than random, unspecific derogatory comments.

Finally, there is no incommunicado between Juri and Ambrosia -- we've been exchanging eMails all along (just sent him one yesterday in fact).

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Andrew Welch / el Presidente / Ambrosia Software, Inc.
(url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/~andrew/")http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/~andrew/(/url)

First, in my opinion, the avara.com frontpage is not a major problem--seeing that there is very little kind of change in this area that would make an impact.

However, what irks me is the semblance to a generic looking "product page." If it's Ambrosia policy to have its pages like so, that's fine, because maybe there are advantages to this sort of uniformity. But..my main complaint is the sacrifice of aesthetics on the front page.

I'll note though, that a practical problem arises when you try to lump everything Avara into two sections: "Options" and "Resources." If I never heard of Avara before or was a confused newbie, the Avara.com frontpage wouldn't do much for initial enthusiasm or pertinent information.

"Finally, there is no incommunicado between Juri and Ambrosia -- we've been exchanging eMails all along (just sent him one yesterday in fact)."

From what Juri has said, he has had no answer when he has tried to get one form you... I'm not saying you didn't just e-mail him... I'm suggesting that the e-mail you just sent was, not the first, but the only one that may have given Juri any clarification on what you are tyring to say... a big fat "no"... Use your wording more carfuly please...

-Kyle "Vader" Blessing

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Originally posted by Vader@Work:
**
From what Juri has said, he has had no answer when he has tried to get one form you... I'm not saying you didn't just e-mail him... I'm suggesting that the e-mail you just sent was, not the first, but the only one that may have given Juri any clarification on what you are tyring to say... a big fat "no"... Use your wording more carfuly please...

-Kyle "Vader" Blessing**

Yeah, he apparently sent me a mail weeks ago that I never got (or at least I don't see it anywhere in my in-box). He re-sent it to me, and I'm waiting for a reply from him currently, so no worries.

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Andrew Welch / el Presidente / Ambrosia Software, Inc.
(url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/~andrew/")http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/~andrew/(/url)

Quote

Originally posted by DeathGuru:
**
However, what irks me is the semblance to a generic looking "product page." If it's Ambrosia policy to have its pages like so, that's fine, because maybe there are advantages to this sort of uniformity. But..my main complaint is the sacrifice of aesthetics on the front page.

I'll note though, that a practical problem arises when you try to lump everything Avara into two sections: "Options" and "Resources." If I never heard of Avara before or was a confused newbie, the Avara.com frontpage wouldn't do much for initial enthusiasm or pertinent information.**

Again, I need more specifics... what part of the front page is a sacrifice of aesthetics? I'm looking at the avara.org front page, and the avara.net front page, and the Avara.com page looks pretty good to me aesthetically -- specifically what do you not like about it aesthetically?

As for your second complaint, again, I'm not sure what you're going after. The front page really is there just to get people interested in the game. We have found that people do not read long textual descriptions of games; they go to the main page, if it looks "cool/interesting", they then start checking out the screenshots page (which, incidentally, if you truly wish to help, you can submit some cool screenshots from Avara that we can put up there).

That's about it -- it is then that they decide if they'll download it or not. A small percentage of people do look further, and for them, they can look at the Add-On Files to see all of te extra levels, etc., the Newswire for current news (very similar to the avara.net front page), and Chronicles for Avara-related stories. Of course, there's the Web Links pages, too.

Again... specifically what is the problem, and what would you change? If you want your criticism to be helpful, you'll need to be specific in what you like/don't like (and if possible, why), and even suggest alternatives.

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Andrew Welch / el Presidente / Ambrosia Software, Inc.
(url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/~andrew/")http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/~andrew/(/url)

(This message has been edited by andrew (edited 11-08-2000).)

Quote

Originally posted by DeathGuru:
**
- Lobby Ben Spees to consider an Avaragnarok

**

I should note that in my opinion, if anyone was to work on an Avara 2, this is what should happen:

The Avara source code could be used as reference for certain things, but little of the code would be re-used (the sound system might, for instance). The TURF engine Ben is using in Ragnarok would be used for the game (OpenGL, all of the bells and whistles, runs on both Mac/Windows, could be ported to Linux fairly easily), and you build on that as a foundation.

I ran this idea by Juri; perhaps he's interested. If not, if we find someone who is truly qualified to do such a thing (not just "I know some C"), we'd certainly talk to them.

The game Ben is working on is entirely different, though, he won't be doing Avara 2. And PLEASE note my liberal use of the word "IF" -- I don't want people thinking (again) we're claiming we're actively working on something to this end when we're not.

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Andrew Welch / el Presidente / Ambrosia Software, Inc.
(url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/~andrew/")http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/~andrew/(/url)