Thanks Glenn and Stark and Others on This Board:

Well, I'm not nearly finished with my game either. But because of the posts on this board, I wanted to see if I would have the same problems. Yep. I did. (Just in case you missed it!)

I really do think that the application program is terrific. It lets me do quite a lot of things. I don't have to know Real Basic to do it. I don't have to get Torque and figure out how to place the source code and get other things in order for it to work. Coldstone just doesn't like some things. I guess that I'm also afraid that the developers are too busy building Goliath to care about Coldstone, especially since they announced its upcoming arrival (although it IS for themselves according to what I've read, which doesn't make a lot of sense why they would announce it in the first place.) But ... people are telling me that they ARE addressing the bugs and I need to trust that.

As for me, I've decided to rebuild my game from scratch -- nearly. So I'm doing a different one. I have NO idea if my experiences will help you and the developers get the bugs out, but I think it may be a good idea for me to tell you as I go through it again, this time with some knowledge about how it works.

I copied only the graphic files into my new game that I know I want to use at this point.

I'm using the same map. But I had originally made the map larger than what it is and placed pictures. I started from the bottom. Big mistake. I began again from the top left corner and built my Cave with 95% Coldstone's graphics. But I reduced the map size without taking away the pictures from the bottom.

Today I enlarged the map size and deleted the pictures. Then I resized the map to the size where the pictures define the edges.

I'm using 90% of Coldstone's graphics for my Game_Interface pictures. I am now in process of selecting the game interface pictures and editing them. I can do two before Coldstone cannot see most of Coldstone's graphics in the Game_Interface file. I have to save the options and quit Coldstone, then open Coldstone and proceed. If I don't do this, my computer freezes and I have to reboot.

It seems to me that this is an indication of a problem.

I noticed that Stray used all lowercase letters. Is there some reason for that? I noticed that Coldstone translated my "Druid" to "druid". Another bug I think.

That's it for now.

------------------
-- Debra
Danillitphil Productions

Quote

Originally posted by Debra: **
Thanks Glenn and Stark and Others on This Board:

Well, I'm not nearly finished with my game either. But because of the posts on this board, I wanted to see if I would have the same problems. Yep. I did. (Just in case you missed it!)

I really do think that the application program is terrific. It lets me do quite a lot of things. I don't have to know Real Basic to do it. I don't have to get Torque and figure out how to place the source code and get other things in order for it to work. Coldstone just doesn't like some things. I guess that I'm also afraid that the developers are too busy building Goliath to care about Coldstone, especially since they announced its upcoming arrival (although it IS for themselves according to what I've read, which doesn't make a lot of sense why they would announce it in the first place.) But ... people are telling me that they ARE addressing the bugs and I need to trust that.**

Well, I've been in touch with David Dunham (ASW Tech Support) and he assured me that Dee is indeed working very hard to try to resolve this problem, and we have been told that a patch will be released to the testers... hopefully it won't take very long!

As for announcing Goliath, it's probably because they are using the engine to create the VATZ, so the engine's completion means the game becomes that much closer. At least, I'm assuming so.

Quote

**
As for me, I've decided to rebuild my game from scratch -- nearly. So I'm doing a different one. I have NO idea if my experiences will help you and the developers get the bugs out, but I think it may be a good idea for me to tell you as I go through it again, this time with some knowledge about how it works.

<schnipp>

I'm using 90% of Coldstone's graphics for my Game_Interface pictures. I am now in process of selecting the game interface pictures and editing them. I can do two before Coldstone cannot see most of Coldstone's graphics in the Game_Interface file. I have to save the options and quit Coldstone, then open Coldstone and proceed. If I don't do this, my computer freezes and I have to reboot.

It seems to me that this is an indication of a problem.**

Hrm. That's interesting... so you are editing two of the interface pictures in the editor at once, and Coldstone crashes your computer? Is that right, or did I read that wrong?

Quote

**
I noticed that Stray used all lowercase letters. Is there some reason for that? I noticed that Coldstone translated my "Druid" to "druid". Another bug I think.**

Ahh yes... the old Class select bug. I've experienced it myself in Epitheisterra, and as far as I can tell, it's completely unpredictable.... it appears when the game is compiled both with the Classic version and the Carbon version, and it appears in both versions of the game. However, whether it appears or not is rather a shot in the dark... at one point, every test build I did for a fortnight possessed it, then one didn't, then they all did again. And I couldn't isolate any problem... because after it worked, I recomplied the exact same data, and it appeared again. Sigh.

Hopefully 1.0.2 will resolve some of these issues. I only hope we get it soon.

-Andiyar

------------------
"Any good that I may do here, let me do now, for I may not pass this way again"

::doesn't know whether to be offended or amused::
Are we taking stabs at me or what?
-----------
I have limited experience with REAL Basic, i've never been able to scrape up the $200 to pay for it, i am by no means a RB wizard...I do have the uncanny ability to maliciously defrock any piece of software at anytime, contorting it to my every whim...a mcehanical gipetto a binay nostradamus ::bellowing laughter:: --
-----------
No, but seriously, i'm good at crashing things and i have quick eyes...i simply watched the building process,
and spotted;
what file it halted
trashed it and the others of its type.
-----------
however you're absolutely right, no one should have to be able to figure that out. They should just be able to click build release and the engine should chug along merry at its task.
-----------
The biggest problem i feel with the engine, is its lack of detailed error reports, and warnings
and a scant users manual...in short the engine lacks polish.
If these functions and resources were in place then you would see what i see, and i wouldn't have to perform experiments utilizing 'the scientific method' just to find out that my game won't run because i have an alias file. I know that coldstone isn't a coding environment but i would expect it to have the simplest error report features in place,

or perhaps a operating assistant like that blasted MicroSoft Office paperClip.

------------------

• (url="http://"http://www.geocities.com/ellrx/index.html")eLL' softWare: "eLL'_e_vated" :Last updated 11.17.02(/url)

• (url="http://"http://ellrx.web1000.com/index.html")eLL' webDesign Portfolio(/url)

• (url="http://"http://www.geocities.com/ellrx/download/index.html")5 coldStone specific PDFs(/url)

Quote

Originally posted by Debra:
**Well, I'm into my game and doing well so I thought I'd see what happens when I built a release. I've done absolutely nothing out of the ordinary. That is, I've not tried to use the engine any way that it wasn't designed to do according to the manual. Also, I habitually try EVERYTHING I build into the game to see that it works correctly via the launch button.

I built it only for Mac (not OX)

No sound.
No music.

It asked for my registration code, and said that the game was built with an unregistered Coldstone engine. I never did download the demo. I paid for it and waited until I got the CD and loaded the CD. I put in my code before I did anything.

It did quite well, except for sound and music, until into the game. My Player tried to pick up something and it crashed.

I'm not an alarmist. I'm no longer creating my game in Coldstone. I'll wait for when they get the bugs out. Or I find an engine for Mac that works. Meantime, I'll work on graphics. If they DO get the bugs out, I expect to NOT pay extra for it.

**

I have posted it once, I'll do it again...

To put it bluntly coldstone SUCKS! If you want a real game egine try (url="http://"http://www.garagegames.com/")Torque.(/url).

WR

------------------
'You will do nothing but die!' - Edwin, BG II
Bored? Come visit (url="http://"http://wr-studios.port5.com/phpBB2/index.php")WR Forums(/url)!

Willie hears ya Willie don't care...
----------------
Debra, the author of this topic, mentioned Torque, said she wasn't that interested and moved on. No need to use the quote function when your just reiterating a point which no one seems to make any loud remarks similar to;
"Your Right"
"Hail Torque"
"Must have Torque"
"Long live the King"
"Oh yeah...three thrusts for Torque"
"Wake the stars, alert the Moon,Tell Saturn... Torque is back"
"The LA times gives Torque 4 stars"
----------------
Thanks for voicing your boisterous unwavering alternative, and besides when DIM 3 comes out Torque will simply be overPriced.
----------------
Do you really have nothing better to do? Perhaps build a torque game called ColdStone Vendetta, in which you hunt down and slay innumerable blue trees and convert its enslaved minions to the light.
----------------
::kisses his only positive Karma point GoodBye, watches as it smolders from (insert Moderator Here)'s potent modified "Buddha's Palm" 5 style Shaolin KungFU Master Level Technique. ::
----------------
Debra, the author of this topic, from her report.... now has a subtantially operable version of her game. YOur soapBox has collasped, like the bleachers at an Army - Navy football game.
----------------
::Jams a wrench into your spokes::
Looks like your spin has come to an end...
----------------
PS,the forums in your sig are in disrepair, and even offered me the option of installation when i followed the link, quote:

Quote

Thank you for choosing phpBB 2. In order to complete this install please fill out the details requested below. Please note that the database you install into should already exist. If you are installing to a database that uses ODBC, e.g. MS Access you should first create a DSN for it before proceeding.

------------------

• (url="http://"http://www.geocities.com/ellrx/index.html")eLL' softWare: "eLL'_e_vated" :Last updated 11.17.02(/url)

• (url="http://"http://ellrx.web1000.com/index.html")eLL' webDesign Portfolio(/url)

• (url="http://"http://www.geocities.com/ellrx/download/index.html")5 coldStone specific PDFs(/url)

(EDIT) "We need more Sarcasm Cap'n, i cannuh hold it nuh Longahhrrrrr!!!!" (/EDIT)

(This message has been edited by ellrx (edited 11-25-2002).)

Your sarcasm is grand, Ellrx! I didn't know that you could be so delightful!

Surely the Coldstone gods wouldn't take away your one and only positive point for that! With my rants, I expected at LEAST one gone! The ones in the nether never never are indeed merciful.

While I won't guarantee that I won't rant again, and since I started this line, I'd like the honor to request it closed and locked and let it run its 20 day life.

Perhaps that's because I've begun another! One without the anger. It's good to be my old self again.

------------------
-- Debra
Danillitphil Productions

Quote

Originally posted by ellrx:
**Willie hears ya Willie don't care...
----------------
Debra, the author of this topic, mentioned Torque, said she wasn't that interested and moved on. No need to use the quote function when your just reiterating a point which no one seems to make any loud remarks similar to;
"Your Right"
"Hail Torque"
"Must have Torque"
"Long live the King"
"Oh yeah...three thrusts for Torque"
"Wake the stars, alert the Moon,Tell Saturn... Torque is back"
"The LA times gives Torque 4 stars"
----------------
Thanks for voicing your boisterous unwavering alternative, and besides when DIM 3 comes out Torque will simply be overPriced.
----------------
Do you really have nothing better to do? Perhaps build a torque game called ColdStone Vendetta, in which you hunt down and slay innumerable blue trees and convert its enslaved minions to the light.
----------------
::kisses his only positive Karma point GoodBye, watches as it smolders from (insert Moderator Here)'s potent modified "Buddha's Palm" 5 style Shaolin KungFU Master Level Technique. ::

You're right, but I updated the link, you should come and join, we could use someone like you around.

WR
----------------
Debra, the author of this topic, from her report.... now has a subtantially operable version of her game. YOur soapBox has collasped, like the bleachers at an Army - Navy football game.
----------------
::Jams a wrench into your spokes::
Looks like your spin has come to an end...
----------------
PS,the forums in your sig are in disrepair, and even offered me the option of installation when i followed the link, quote:

Quote

Thank you for choosing phpBB 2. In order to complete this install please fill out the details requested below. Please note that the database you install into should already exist. If you are installing to a database that uses ODBC, e.g. MS Access you should first create a DSN for it before proceeding.

**

------------------
'You will do nothing but die!' - Edwin, BG II
Bored? Come visit (url="http://"http://www.gug.ca/members/shi/phpBB2/index.php")WR Forums(/url)!

Quote

Originally posted by ellrx:
**Willie hears ya Willie don't care...
----------------
Debra, the author of this topic, mentioned Torque, said she wasn't that interested and moved on. No need to use the quote function when your just reiterating a point which no one seems to make any loud remarks similar to;
"Your Right"
"Hail Torque"
"Must have Torque"
"Long live the King"
"Oh yeah...three thrusts for Torque"
"Wake the stars, alert the Moon,Tell Saturn... Torque is back"
"The LA times gives Torque 4 stars"
----------------
Thanks for voicing your boisterous unwavering alternative, and besides when DIM 3 comes out Torque will simply be overPriced.
----------------
Do you really have nothing better to do? Perhaps build a torque game called ColdStone Vendetta, in which you hunt down and slay innumerable blue trees and convert its enslaved minions to the light.
----------------
::kisses his only positive Karma point GoodBye, watches as it smolders from (insert Moderator Here)'s potent modified "Buddha's Palm" 5 style Shaolin KungFU Master Level Technique. ::
----------------
Debra, the author of this topic, from her report.... now has a subtantially operable version of her game. YOur soapBox has collasped, like the bleachers at an Army - Navy football game.
----------------
::Jams a wrench into your spokes::
Looks like your spin has come to an end...
----------------
PS,the forums in your sig are in disrepair, and even offered me the option of installation when i followed the link, quote:

Quote

Thank you for choosing phpBB 2. In order to complete this install please fill out the details requested below. Please note that the database you install into should already exist. If you are installing to a database that uses ODBC, e.g. MS Access you should first create a DSN for it before proceeding.

**

O, and BTW, pick up a copy of Torque..

------------------
'You will do nothing but die!' - Edwin, BG II
Bored? Come visit (url="http://"http://www.gug.ca/members/shi/phpBB2/index.php")WR Forums(/url)!

(This message has been edited by Sniberal (edited 11-26-2002).)

Quote

Originally posted by ellrx:
**Willie hears ya Willie don't care...
----------------
<snip> <snip> <snip>
**

Heh, wow, that was a blast from the past. The Chill rides again!

- "Glenndella"

------------------
I don't know what I'm talking about.
Oh no, here comes another learning experience.
(url="http://"http://homepage.mac.com/glennfield/ColdstoneBugs.html")Coldstone 1.0.1 Bug List(/url) - last update 10/10/2002
(url="http://"http://www.ambrosiasw.com/webboard/Forum48/HTML/001547.html")Stark Bledfast's Coldstone Debugging 101(/url)

Not everyone here wants to program, and ColdStone is less costly and does what it was meant to do quite well.
(edit)Found you've updated your link... oopsies!(/edit)
------------------
Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool.
"Logic is futile"-Scott Adams

(This message has been edited by spitfire (edited 11-26-2002).)

Quote

Originally posted by spitfire:
Not everyone here wants to program, and ColdStone is less costly and does what it was meant to do quite well.
(edit)Found you've updated your link... oopsies!(/edit)

Two things: You do not have to program with Torque but you can, and it is only $100, that really isn't that much at all...

WR

------------------
'You will do nothing but die!' - Edwin, BG II
Bored? Come visit (url="http://"http://www.gug.ca/members/shi/phpBB2/index.php")WR Forums(/url)!

Dim 3? What's that?

------------------
-- Debra
Danillitphil Productions

Quote

Original banter by Ellrx and Sniberal: **
~snip~**

Hahaha.

Nothing like getting my morning humor.

------------------
(url="http://"http://stark.evula.net/pogwalkthrough.htm")PoG Walkthrough and Compendium(/url) | (url="http://"http://stark.evula.net/plugins/dev_tools.htm")PoG Dev Tools(/url) | (url="http://"http://stark.evula.net/plugins/spells_expander.htm")Spells Expander(/url)
(url="http://"http://stark.evula.net")Stark.evula.net(/url) | (url="http://"http://www.evula.net")EVula.net(/url) | (url="http://"http://mail.ambrosiasw.com/mailman/listinfo/coldstone_dev")Coldstone-dev mailing list(/url)

I'm glad your build worked!

I my self have tried those same options to no avail. I cannot get a working build and according to Dee there is good reason why this is the case. I have supplied source files to Beenox and they cannot get it to build either.

"ColdStone is less costly and does what it was meant to do quite well."

The last part of this sentence I must take issue with.

It seems like all of the "beta testers" are slightly defensive about the fact that such large bugs eluded them. Most of them still seem not to want to acknowledge the bug. One beta tester here admitted that they never even tested the build function at all.

Does it work? Does it not work?

I leave you with a quote from Dee:
"Yes, this is all side effects of the same bug: the compilation comes to an unexpected halt which prevents the copy of any additional media (sounds, movies, music), prevents the registration process to complete, and finally, prevents the copy of a file needed under Windows."

CG

------------------

Quote

Originally posted by cgoran:
It seems like all of the "beta testers" are slightly defensive about the fact that such large bugs eluded them. Most of them still seem not to want to acknowledge the bug. One beta tester here admitted that they never even tested the build function at all.

Wow. Did I really come across that way? Let me try again.

I put a lot of time and effort into finding bugs in Coldstone during the various betas, and I'm frustrated to find that there's so many bugs that I didn't catch. My "job" as a beta tester was to help stop these sorts of problems from being present in the public release - since they are, apparently I didn't do my job well. :frown:

The only time that I might justifiably get a bit defensive is when people say, in effect, "Because Coldstone currently has a critical bug X in it, the entire engine is and will remain utterly worthless." I don't believe that, and, I hope, neither do you.

Quote

I leave you with a quote from Dee:
"Yes, this is all side effects of the same bug: the compilation comes to an unexpected halt which prevents the copy of any additional media (sounds, movies, music), prevents the registration process to complete, and finally, prevents the copy of a file needed under Windows."

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make by repeating this statement, which I'm sure we're all well aware of, but let me offer my take on it: This whole slew of problems is being caused (as far as Dee can tell) by a single bug - as soon as that one bug is fixed, all of the listed problems will be fixed as well. I would consider that to be a very good thing.

------------------
I don't know what I'm talking about.
Oh no, here comes another learning experience.
(url="http://"http://homepage.mac.com/glennfield/ColdstoneBugs.html")Coldstone 1.0.1 Bug List(/url) - last update 10/10/2002
(url="http://"http://www.ambrosiasw.com/webboard/Forum48/HTML/001547.html")Stark Bledfast's Coldstone Debugging 101(/url)

"Willie hears ya Willie don't care...
----------------
Debra, the author of this topic, mentioned Torque, said she wasn't that interested and moved on. No need to use the quote function when your just reiterating a point which no one seems to make any loud remarks similar to;
"Your Right"
"Hail Torque"
"Must have Torque"
"Long live the King"
"Oh yeah...three thrusts for Torque"
"Wake the stars, alert the Moon,Tell Saturn... Torque is back"
"The LA times gives Torque 4 stars"
----------------
Thanks for voicing your boisterous unwavering alternative, and besides when DIM 3 comes out Torque will simply be overPriced.
----------------
Do you really have nothing better to do? Perhaps build a torque game called ColdStone Vendetta, in which you hunt down and slay innumerable blue trees and convert its enslaved minions to the light.
----------------
::kisses his only positive Karma point GoodBye, watches as it smolders from (insert Moderator Here)'s potent modified "Buddha's Palm" 5 style Shaolin KungFU Master Level Technique. ::
----------------
Debra, the author of this topic, from her report.... now has a subtantially operable version of her game. YOur soapBox has collasped, like the bleachers at an Army - Navy football game.
----------------
::Jams a wrench into your spokes::
Looks like your spin has come to an end..."
----------------

Sorry Glenn.

I found this post irritating and somewhat mocking. So I felt compelled to retort. And to remind folks that there is still a real bug in the program. I'm left in a lurch until that update is released.

I thank you for your efforts.

Cheers,
CG

------------------

Quote

Originally posted by cgoran:
**"Willie hears ya Willie don't care...
----------------
Debra, the author of this topic, mentioned Torque, said she wasn't that interested and moved on. No need to use the quote function when your just reiterating a point which no one seems to make any loud remarks similar to;
"Your Right"
"Hail Torque"
"Must have Torque"
"Long live the King"
"Oh yeah...three thrusts for Torque"
"Wake the stars, alert the Moon,Tell Saturn... Torque is back"
"The LA times gives Torque 4 stars"
----------------
Thanks for voicing your boisterous unwavering alternative, and besides when DIM 3 comes out Torque will simply be overPriced.
----------------
Do you really have nothing better to do? Perhaps build a torque game called ColdStone Vendetta, in which you hunt down and slay innumerable blue trees and convert its enslaved minions to the light.
----------------
::kisses his only positive Karma point GoodBye, watches as it smolders from (insert Moderator Here)'s potent modified "Buddha's Palm" 5 style Shaolin KungFU Master Level Technique. ::
----------------
Debra, the author of this topic, from her report.... now has a subtantially operable version of her game. YOur soapBox has collasped, like the bleachers at an Army - Navy football game.
----------------
::Jams a wrench into your spokes::
Looks like your spin has come to an end..."
----------------

Sorry Glenn.

I found this post irritating and somewhat mocking. So I felt compelled to retort. And to remind folks that there is still a real bug in the program. I'm left in a lurch until that update is released.

I thank you for your efforts.

Cheers,
CG

**

Yes, I was very insulted by this post, I was only trying to help...

WR

------------------
'You will do nothing but die!' - Edwin, BG II
Bored? Come visit (url="http://"http://www.gug.ca/members/shi/phpBB2/index.php")WR Forums(/url)!

have you ever noticed the webBoard convention of 'snip' its a very useful literary allusion used to prevent threads/topics from becoming bloated...now if you'll notice the only original post that begins with "willie hears ya' willie don't care" is mine, therefore providing the opening sentence and using something similar to 'snip' or '...' 'etc' or something of that considerate nature prevents spam and bloating...in addition the use of the quote/reply button formats the quoted text and allows users to quickly distinguish between that which has been said and that which is being spoken...i'll refer you to the posting guidelines/perhaps a page on internet ettiquette...
------------
Sniberal...did that make you feel any better?
so far you've managed to duplicate/spam my post a total of 3 times, making an extra 3 pages from a single page message...hmmm 'fourPage Letter'...how does that song go again.
What help did you offer, you've written about a total of 5 sentences, synopsis;

Quote

Coldstone sucks
" "
its only 100 bucks.
Yes i am offended as well.

My dry response:
_
::smiling nodding::
" "
" "
" "
_

The only one that would warrant a separate post would be your most recent reply which has piggy backed in on a mountain of spam.
------------
Specifically Oran-
if you found that post to be mocking or offensive then i'll refer you to the search function of the board, try the partial member name 'chill'...upon completion you'll find an amusing assortment of 169 episodes, which i'm sure you'll find to be aimed directly against your pristine essence...my sincerest apology. I believe paranoia is a shade of pink, non ?
------------
There are general boards about gaming, one in particular community is designed for this path of interaction...(url="http://"http://www.idevgames.com")iDevGames(/url)
------------

------------------

• (url="http://"http://www.geocities.com/ellrx/index.html")eLL' softWare: "eLL'_e_vated" :Last updated 11.17.02(/url)

• (url="http://"http://ellrx.web1000.com/index.html")eLL' webDesign Portfolio(/url)

• (url="http://"http://www.geocities.com/ellrx/download/index.html")5 coldStone specific PDFs(/url)

DIM 3, which can also be found at (url="http://"http://www.idevgames.com")iDevGames(/url)
The developer is very active, you can find his dev diary there as well..

DIM3 is a free 3D Development Environment, which is coded based on standard ECMA JAVAscript. Environments beget frameworks/engines which beget games in turn.
It is not currently available, and is on track for Spring release.

------------------

• (url="http://"http://www.geocities.com/ellrx/index.html")eLL' softWare: "eLL'_e_vated" :Last updated 11.17.02(/url)

• (url="http://"http://ellrx.web1000.com/index.html")eLL' webDesign Portfolio(/url)

• (url="http://"http://www.geocities.com/ellrx/download/index.html")5 coldStone specific PDFs(/url)

ellrx,

You must one of the "beta testers" that failed us.
Non?

------------------