Thanks. What do mean by custom scripts btw? Do you mean creating bosses that have new movement routines?

@silverwind, on Aug 26 2007, 03:34 PM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

Thanks. What do mean by custom scripts btw? Do you mean creating bosses that have new movement routines?

Yes, and you could probably give them different weapons also.

@---, on Aug 26 2007, 05:27 AM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

I'm pretty sure there are a few that aren't used in any of the parts of PMS that could be hijacked for replacement.

Almost certainly, although it would be a lot easier if CAE were modified to allow adding new files in addition to replacing existing files. Anyone want to try setting that up?

@---, on Aug 26 2007, 07:45 AM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

Yes, and you could probably give them different weapons also.

Certainly, particularly if you also changed/added some sprites in addition to scripts. It also looks like you could also pull off some rather interesting tricks with a couple of rarely-used script actions: Set Extra1 and Set Extra2. If they work they way it looks like they should, they could be quite fun for setting up bosses (Self-healing! Vulnerable to different weapons at different time! Has different dying effects depending on when you kill it!).

Edwards

Hm, I suppose I could make an aircraft carrier along with missile racks and spawning fighters for my boss zone then (although that's obviously not the most exciting of uses for custom scripts - maybe something else...).

A new version of the TC is available here (link is obsolete- see this post for a newer version).

Changes:
- Used new version of the welcome screen.
- Used updated version of Area 1.
- Fixed self-destructing light in Area 2 (Player-type sprites tend to blow up when they contact Solid-type sprites).
- Fixed the border of first miniboss page in Area 4.
- Added save ring to landing platform at end of Area 4.
- Made an unofficial fix for the Area 5 game-stopping bug.
- Used newest version of Area 8.

----------

On a topic related to using custom scripts, I'd like to point out that if we're distributing PMS as a TC, the limits on which Boss names can be used where can be relaxed- you only need to avoid name collisions within a single file, not across the entire TC. To get to the point, this means that we can give two or possibly three of the bosses in Area 10 health meters (depending on whether we can use LastBoss as a non-Pen boss), and all of the bosses can have Boss-type death explosions.

Also, it would be possible to use the Race triggers... <_<
...I call dibs!

----------

In other news, I've made it past the A5 bug, and have a couple more:
- There appears to be an Extra2 conflict somewhere with several of the objects in Area 7. Half of the turret guarding the entrance were disabled when I arrived (Extra2s 1072, 1073, 1074, and 1075), along with the topmost of the three turrets in the caldera (Extra2 1071). However, those Extra2s do not occur in any previous level, so I suspect that this is a conflict with Extra2s reserved for internal use by the game (this suspicion is amplified by the Solo mission using every Extra2 between 1001 and 1080, except 1020, 1057 through 1060, and 1071 through 1076). I suggest changing these sprites (they are the only ones overlapping these ranges) to use some other values- 1100 through 1140 are unused. Also, we should avoid using Extra2 1099, as it is used in the in-map registration checks.

- I made a mistake when putting in the To Area X text in Area 7, and it says "To Area 9" instead of "To Area 8".

- Not in the TC, but there's a typo in the description of Part 4- the word is "its", not "it's".

@tridash: It would be possible to both fix the reappearing-blockage bug and make it look better (i.e. vanish cleanly, rather than turning black) by making the blockage a child of a door-type sprite that is opened by the switch. Also, did you intend for the wires leading away from the switch in question to be black?

- Current speed record: 32 minutes, three deaths (runs leading to death not included in time).

----------

On a completely different note, an interesting comparison between PMS and the Solo Mission:
Total sprites used in Areas 1-8: 16658
Total sprites in original Solo Mission: 9051

Yes, we're already nearly twice as large as the built-in scenario, and we're still missing two Areas.

Edwards

This post has been edited by Edwards : 03 September 2007 - 05:13 PM

@edwards, on Aug 27 2007, 03:52 AM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

On a topic related to using custom scripts, I'd like to point out that if we're distributing PMS as a TC, the limits on which Boss names can be used where can be relaxed- you only need to avoid name collisions within a single file, not across the entire TC. To get to the point, this means that we can give two or possibly three of the bosses in Area 10 health meters (depending on whether we can use LastBoss as a non-Pen boss), and all of the bosses can have Boss-type death explosions.

Also, it would be possible to use the Race triggers... <_<
...I call dibs!

Hmmm... although multiple bosses and race triggers are cool features that'll certainly be fun to implement, I think we should still maintain (in addition to a CAE TC set) a normal Custom Map style set of the levels as we've been working on, that keeps to the rules of the project. (the boss layouts etc.) This would mean two different Area 10's I suppose, but I don't see anything wrong with that. I myself shall keep mainly to developing the Custom Map set of levels if nobody else minds. (and anyway, we're nearly finished, hehe)

@edwards, on Aug 27 2007, 03:52 AM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

In other news, I've made it past the A5 bug, and have a couple more:
- There appears to be an Extra2 conflict somewhere with several of the objects in Area 7. Half of the turret guarding the entrance were disabled when I arrived (Extra2s 1072, 1073, 1074, and 1075), along with the topmost of the three turrets in the caldera (Extra2 1071). However, those Extra2s do not occur in any previous level, so I suspect that this is a conflict with Extra2s reserved for internal use by the game (this suspicion is amplified by the Solo mission using every Extra2 between 1001 and 1080, except 1020, 1057 through 1060, and 1071 through 1076). I suggest changing these sprites (they are the only ones overlapping these ranges) to use some other values- 1100 through 1140 are unused. Also, we should avoid using Extra2 1099, as it is used in the in-map registration checks.

All the more reasons why I want to reserve myself to the Custom Map set of levels, lol!

@edwards, on Aug 27 2007, 03:52 AM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

- Not in the TC, but there's a typo in the description of Part 4- the word is "its", not "it's".

I think I did that... ooops! I've fixed it, so when we release the final package it'll be updated.

@edwards, on Aug 27 2007, 03:52 AM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

On a completely different note, an interesting comparison between PMS and the Solo Mission:
Total sprites used in Areas 1-8: 16658
Total sprites in original Solo Mission: 9051

Yes, we're already nearly twice as large as the built-in scenario, and we're still missing two Areas.

Edwards

Wow! I'd no idea PMS contained that many sprites! Nice work guys.

PS.

Area 9 is now available to download!

The stupendous Area 9 takes you once again through the many solo mode zones, but it's not blisteringly hard like many other people's attempts at this style. Congratulations to Conelight who worked incredibly hard for weeks to bring us this superb addition to PMS!

Issues (hopefully) now fixed for Area 5 - attached part 3.

Attached File(s)

• Project_Multi_Sketch_Part_3.zip (47.26K)
  Number of downloads: 2

Quote

Almost certainly, although it would be a lot easier if CAE were modified to allow adding new files in addition to replacing existing files. Anyone want to try setting that up?

I'm pretty sure I did that when I adapted the CAE for use with Midnight Mansion (that version I called Decorum, which I like better than CAE, but I may as well leave the name as is; can't be too flaky with such things). I may have time tonight to see how easy it would be to merge those changes back into the CAE code.

EDIT: PS: Has anyone encountered any bugs in CAE that I could try and fix when I hit the code again?

This post has been edited by cheleball : 27 August 2007 - 11:22 AM

@silverwind, on Aug 27 2007, 05:04 AM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

Hmmm... although multiple bosses and race triggers are cool features that'll certainly be fun to implement, I think we should still maintain (in addition to a CAE TC set) a normal Custom Map style set of the levels as we've been working on, that keeps to the rules of the project.

All right. I may stick with my original idea for a boss arena, then, and not bother making a variant with a time limit (although being able to use teleporters would be cool enough that I just might make two versions anyway...).

@silverwind, on Aug 27 2007, 05:04 AM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

Area 9 is now available to download!

Response to Area 9:
The Good:

• Overall, nice level- a well-deserved break from the usual high difficulty level before going into the final Boss fights.

• The bubbles in the Volcano floor are a very nice touch- I'd like to try combining them with invisible Lava Particles in some level where you don't have Ship II.

• I like the

Spoiler

trapdoor concept, as well as the exploding Electrodes just before it.

• Spoiler

Whether or not you intended for theplayer to take damage if they tried to wiggle in to the last blue switch, it's a nice touch.

The Bad:

• Since when do you have 10 missiles?

• It's quite hard (perhaps too hard) to find the

Spoiler

red switch in the water area

• You might want to add a few single single lines, as in a normal area transition, to the end of the first Volcano area.

• The exit passage looks very, very boring. May I suggest that the first person to work on Area 10 start a bit closer to the last door of Area 9 than is marked?

The Bugly

• The boxes surrounding most of the in-wall lights can be destroyed by the wave gun.

• The end of the level isn't marked, or capped with a Race Goal.

• There are some one-pixel gaps in the level background.

@cheleball, on Aug 27 2007, 09:17 AM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

EDIT: PS: Has anyone encountered any bugs in CAE that I could try and fix when I hit the code again?

Well, there's always the development issue where if you don't make sure that the SwitchHouse folder structure matches that of the Assets folder, CAE nukes your SketchFighter install.

Edwards

Quote

Well, there's always the development issue where if you don't make sure that the SwitchHouse folder structure matches that of the Assets folder, CAE nukes your SketchFighter install.

Does it really? I know that you can (or ought to be able to) omit folders from the structure, but I don't think I ever tested it with misnamed folders. Can you tell me more about what's happening?

@edwards, on Aug 27 2007, 10:23 PM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

(*)Since when do you have 10 missiles?

Missi- Oh! Dear me I didn't notice that one when going through the level. Not to worry, I'll fix it.

@edwards, on Aug 27 2007, 10:23 PM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

(*)It's quite hard (perhaps too hard) to find the

Spoiler

red switch in the water area

I kinda liked that feature actually, but maybe it's just me. Perhaps getting rid of the Mega Mine next to it which turns people off from exploring that corner would help?

@edwards, on Aug 27 2007, 10:23 PM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

(*)You might want to add a few single single lines, as in a normal area transition, to the end of the first Volcano area.

Actually, this was done in haste when Conelight asked me to round up his level. I forgot to add those lines. Again, this will be fixed in the update.

@edwards, on Aug 27 2007, 10:23 PM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

(*)The exit passage looks very, very boring. May I suggest that the first person to work on Area 10 start a bit closer to the last door of Area 9 than is marked?

lol! I'm afraid I am the culprit behind this! Yes, even I, the obsessor of detail get lazy, and this is proof. Needless to say the update holds the cure to that abominable eyesore I'm ashamed to have spawned.

@edwards, on Aug 27 2007, 10:23 PM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

(*)The boxes surrounding most of the in-wall lights can be destroyed by the wave gun.

Fixed.

@edwards, on Aug 27 2007, 10:23 PM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

(*)The end of the level isn't marked, or capped with a Race Goal.

I uh... fixed.

@edwards, on Aug 27 2007, 10:23 PM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

(*)There are some one-pixel gaps in the level background.

... you know the saying.

@silverwind, on Aug 27 2007, 03:09 PM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

I kinda liked that feature actually, but maybe it's just me. Perhaps getting rid of the Mega Mine next to it which turns people off from exploring that corner would help?

No, the mine might indicate that there is something of interest in there. Perhaps drop the alpha value on those three walls by about 15%? (Note: by , not to.)

@cheleball, on Aug 27 2007, 02:48 PM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

Does it really? I know that you can (or ought to be able to) omit folders from the structure, but I don't think I ever tested it with misnamed folders. Can you tell me more about what's happening?

With the latest version of CAE that I have (version 1.0, created January 19th), if you have a folder in Assets/Data, but not in SwitchHouse/Data, CAE will put your new files into the game properly, but when it tries to put everything back to normal, it turns the affected subfolder of SketchFighter into a document. I think that all the data is still there, as it stays the right size, but it is a document, not a folder. SketchFighter, understandably, does not like this new state of affairs very much, and fails to load.

If SwitchHouse/Data is missing, you simply get an error when the script tries to use mv, and nothing happens.

Edwards

This post has been edited by Edwards : 27 August 2007 - 06:22 PM

Looks like the changes will merge fairly gracefully, except that I made a simplifying assumption that is not valid with SketchFighter, and I'm far too tired tonight to fix it.

As for Edwards' bug... :blink: :blink: That is an extremely weird bug. I know that, at one point, you were allowed to omit directories from the Switchhouse and it worked. The only thing I can think of is that I made some last-minute changes for 10.2 compatibility, and that may have messed it up. It was oh so long ago. I'll have a look...later.

BTW, about 10.2 compatibility. I no longer have access to a machine capable of running 10.2 (the one I used last time belonged to my work and I no longer work there). So, unless there's someone in the community who does and is willing to test, I'm afraid I can no longer assure compatibility with Jaguar after I make these changes. I won't do anything to intentionally break it, but the issues I fixed for compatibility last time were odd AppleScript quirks/bugs that I never could have anticipated being there without testing.

So, when are we going to start in on Area 10, and what order are we going to be working in?
Current volunteers for Area 10:
tridash
Dogbert
Edwards
Silverwind?

Also, what's the status on the updated version of Area 9?

Edwards

I'd help on area 10, but i don't exactly know what it is or what i would do. Halp plz?

This post has been edited by PiSketch : 31 August 2007 - 03:16 PM

@Pi: Area 10 is kinda like a set of "mini Area's" designed by various participants that contain 1 Boss room each. Anyone is welcome to build a Boss for Area 10, but they only have a time limit of 1 week to do so.

@Edwards: The update of Area 9 will be downloadable in just a moment. (I forgot to upload it earlier... ooops!) As for the order of participants for Area 10, I suppose whoever's willing to take the file first can get the job. I personally wouldn't be able to take it for a week or so.

I'm updating the Rules section in the topic's first post to contain information on Area 10.

i'm currently working on starcraft custom maps so ill take last.

Is there a reason you can't all design at once and then merge together?

BTW, I haven't had much time to work on CAE, but I will (hopefully) have the new version done RSN.

@silverwind, on Aug 31 2007, 04:41 PM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

@Edwards: The update of Area 9 will be downloadable in just a moment. (I forgot to upload it earlier... ooops!)

How often must I tell people to test their levels before releasing them? Two of the walls that should be non-Solid on the path to the Red switch are Solid, so it is impossible to complete the level as it stands.

@cheleball, on Sep 1 2007, 06:56 PM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

Is there a reason you can't all design at once and then merge together?

I don't see why not. You would need to spend a few minutes putting together a transition from the previous boss after SMMing in the new boss, but the arena itself could be done without having the previous boss (as long as Extra2s are assigned ahead of time- I can have a list of available Extra2s in PMS by Monday).

----------

Now, I've put together a new version of PMSTC, including Area 9, the fixed version of Area 5, and several other fixes. You can download it here.

Change List:

• Explicitly set all pickups without Extra2s to use Extra2s 1101-1105, as they are not automatically assigned Extra2s in Solo Mission mode.

• Fixed the page boundary in Area 4 AGAIN.

• Fixed bug that allowed A4 airship turrets to destroy their off-switch.

• Used new version of Area 5.

• Set the A7 non-functional Extra2s to be 1111-1116.

• Set the Extra2 of the holder for the A7 Caldera switch to match the switch itself.

• Fixed up the pickup's surroundings in A7 to something a bit closer to the original (although I seem to have lost the original level file, so it isn't perfect).

• Set the Wasteland-Factory door in A8 to use Extra2 1086 so that it will not lock behind the player if they die.

• Added Area 9.

• Fixed A9 wall bug mentioned above.

• Changed the pickup in A9 to use 1087, so that it does not collide with the A8 fix.

• Added a new ending zone. No, this is not my entry for Area 10.

• Re-synced my collection of .SketchMap files for the TC to the .LMScenes, as apparently they had reverted their state as of Beta 1. I think my backup gremlins were drunk this week, and ran the process in reverse.

Anyone may feel free to make any of these changes to their Area officially, but apart from the A9 wall, they don't really matter for the SketchMap version.

Bugs: The Skull Turret in the A7 Garbage Room miniboss is blocked from hitting the player by the boss's Solid hull.

Current speed record: 30:47, with about half a dozen deaths, one of them intentional.

Edwards

@edwards, on Sep 2 2007, 08:33 AM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

How often must I tell people to test their levels before releasing them? Two of the walls that should be non-Solid on the path to the Red switch are Solid, so it is impossible to complete the level as it stands.

(usual gasp!) Sorry once again folks, the updated file is now available to download. Thankfully only Edwards and myself had downloaded the buggy file, so no one else experienced this glitch. (hide the evidence! Yes, yes... hide the evidence...) Sorry for any inconvenience caused.

@edwards, on Sep 2 2007, 08:33 AM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

I don't see why not. You would need to spend a few minutes putting together a transition from the previous boss after SMMing in the new boss, but the arena itself could be done without having the previous boss (as long as Extra2s are assigned ahead of time- I can have a list of available Extra2s in PMS by Monday).

I don't think there's a problem with people designing their Area's all at once and then merging them together, but at the moment everyone seems unable to design their Area's at all let alone at once. Dogbert is working on starcraft custom maps, I'm programming an RPG, and Edwards (aside from finding and fixing holes in our Area's ) is working hard on the TC. Plus, I quote him saying:

@edwards, on Aug 10 2007, 06:33 PM, said in Project Multi Sketch:

I'll take anything except for last.

Also, I won't be around much for the next week, so don't expect a speedy response to any questions.

Edwards

Having said that however, a week has long since elapsed, and Tridash and Pi have also expressed interest in Area 10. I suppose SMMing would solve the time period problem as well, so I guess it's an all around better plan.

In other news, I hope to have the PMS Readme up by the end of today.