I've tried to stay out of this one, and since I totally agree with Hudson on every point he's made I'd decided not to waste bandwidth. But I would like to interject— from an experienced point of view— that the more you talk about your TC, how cool it is, how boffo your random initials are, work on your website and skin your forum, drop images in the gallery without thought or examination of the standards (that go WAY back)— the more you set yourself up for chagrin and disdain when you just kind of stop working on it or break up with your team. Either of these two fates seems like a given in this circumstance, Skratskinner.

Not that I am the oh-so-cool guru or even listened to- I have experienced the fate that I discribe. Don't set yourself up. Just work on your plug or don't and keep your mouth shut about how cool it is so noone is dissapointed when you don't deliver- including yourself.

I always consider the name of the plugin an integral part of the storyline. Your names are all meaningless and are very varied, implying that you haven't even got a clue what your TC is going to be about.

Listen to rmx256. He knows what he's talking about

rmx256, on Mar 3 2006, 06:26 AM, said:

But I would like to interject— from an experienced point of view— that the more you talk about your TC, how cool it is, how boffo your random initials are,

1. how much have I talked about my TC, really? I've mentioned what it might be like, but I
2. see 1)
3. random?

rmx256, on Mar 3 2006, 06:26 AM, said:

work on your website and skin your forum,

Where did that come from? I don't have a website/forum to speak of.

rmx256, on Mar 3 2006, 06:26 AM, said:

drop images in the gallery without thought or examination of the standards (that go WAY back)

?????!!!!! :mad: I do not recall putting anything in the gallery :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

rmx256, on Mar 3 2006, 06:26 AM, said:

— the more you set yourself up for chagrin and disdain when you just kind of stop working on it or break up with your team. Either of these two fates seems like a given in this circumstance, Skratskinner.

What team? (and you spelled my name wrong too)

rmx256, on Mar 3 2006, 06:26 AM, said:

)Not that I am the oh-so-cool guru or even listened to- I have experienced the fate that I discribe. Don't set yourself up. Just work on your plug or don't and keep your mouth shut about how cool it is so noone is dissapointed when you don't deliver- including yourself.
View Post

I count three spelling errors...

Listen up! I am not a bag of hot air! I will get that TC done, whether it takes two years or two decades!

I simply started this post to find out which name people would best like, and apparently it is "Shattering ADA". I did not start this post so people could throw sticks and stones at my claims.

This post has been edited by ScratSkinner : 03 March 2006 - 10:07 PM

ScratSkinner, on Mar 3 2006, 09:19 PM, said:

Listen up! I am not(/) a bag of hot air! I (i)will get that TC done, whether it takes two years or two decades!

View Post

I'm gonna hold you to that....

ScratSkinner, on Mar 3 2006, 08:19 PM, said:

Snap
View Post

You were used as an example for my advice, you being the current topic starter. Frankly I could care less if a spelling error- three, a dozen, however many- creeps into a post that I made within ten minutes of my getting home from work. I've seen very few people fail to make the grammatical faux pas on this or any Internet forum. I was trying to make a calm and evenhanded post that contributed something to this discussion other than the four or five "I totally agree with you Hudson"s that I've started to post and thought better of many times in this thread now as I truly felt compelled to do so. I listed the things that I listed— websites, forums, crappy gallery images, bragging about how cool stuff was that you are making, secretive insiderisms such as "ADA" or "LSD" or "Secret1" or "KNS" being bantered about in public forums in order to make people ask about them or about your plug in general— are all things that I have been guilty of and I felt that I should proselytize as a warning to one whom I personally believe is blowing air.

{long part here removed}

I can't count the number of announced TCs that have been spattered about in this forum using topics just like this one, not excluding my own. You should not in any way be astounded that you've received the response that you have. You should, however, take a look at the people who have taken the time to write qualitative responses to your 'announcement' and perhaps listen to what they have to say. Where you are in your life versus the demands of making a Total Conversion for this or any game versus the fact that (in my opinion) Nova has not time enough left for the TCs that are already underway to be effectively received, let alone for one to start up now and be finished makes a very clear statement about the fate of your 'shattering FO@' or whatever. We'll all soon enough be like the people who are still working on their Override TCs that they started when they still lived at home with their parents and still have the misns to write. I say that with the utmost respect for any developer who reads this post and this forum and for the work that they do because it is a labor of love and is ultimately for the satisfaction of the author, not the audience. All the plus if they like it, and if they don't, they were never meant to understand it to begin with.

So sorry if you took my post a little roughly. Go count the number of posts or polls or whatever like the one you've started here since any random given point versus the total number of completions or even 'longer than three month progress log on EV-Nova.net updates' and then compare that large number to the number of released TCs or even large plugs- being mostly 0 (not counting Polycon, SFA or Arpia I, others I may have forgotten since I don't play Nova).

I sound like a total jerk and I fought hard withmyself before I pressed the 'add reply' button.
::puts on peril-sensitive sunglasses::

Nelsonic, on Mar 4 2006, 01:52 AM, said:

I'm gonna hold you to that....
View Post

Seconded. Let's see you dance.

DANCE!

What the hell is the TC about? Do you even have a rough idea you'd like to share with us? If you shared your idea, you'd most likely get more feedback that would be constructive, and possibly have people offer to help. I've also had TC plans, only to have such an ethusiastic response from board members generate so many ideas that I realized there was no way I could finish in years, and that I had too many things going on in my life to allow me to finish it within the next decade.

LISTEN when people tell you things. Most of them know what they're talking about. It is a LOT of work. It requires that you put insane amounts of time into it, and unless you are a millionaire who doesn't have anything to do at all, and can give up years of your time to devote to this one thing, you'll find that progress will be slow.

Ok, general bitchiness aside, I would like to at least generally agree with Hudson and rmx256. I do think that a name is a difficult part of building a TC, but it is only a very small part. Razzle is atleast in part right, Uncle Twitchy (head of SFA)'s progress log shows itself what a huge effort it requires.

At the end of the day i have never heard of Polycon, nor I expect have many of the other people who initally downloaded. Nor, now do I care. I haven't finished it(no disrepects Anubis), but I think that it is a very good TC nevertheless. As said by others it, unlike many other possibly better named plug-ins, such as ST:FFN and SFA (that is looking good though), it is finished. My real point is that the name is not awefully important, as many people will download it anyway.

Next, your naming ideas. I don't even pretend to know whether the LSD one is a serious idea, if it is what I think it is, but I can't vote without some idea of your TC.

I have a suggestion therefore. I presume that the eventual name will make very little difference to the remainder of the game. Therefore why not do some work on it, then upload some information and screenshots. This way we get to know what it is about, and you get some time to think about (perhaps the name might come to you??) it.

Of course the side benefit of this is that it will be actively adding to the TC and proving to others on this forum that it is not vapourware, but a very good addition to the community (as Im sure it will be).

Meanwhile, why dont we all calm down

Happy gaming and deving

ScratSkinner, on Mar 3 2006, 08:19 PM, said:

<snip>
View Post

I agree with you. Everyone else, the more you bash on the creators of TCs the less work will actually get done. Calm down and let the man do his project. Even if he doesn't have lots of fantastic ideas now, he can think of them later. And frankly I'm sure he has some ideas, or he wouldn't have started working on it in the first place. None of us have any idea how it is going, but Hudson is accusing him of throwing obsacles in his own way so he won't have to work and many other claims without basis. Excessive critisism is the real obsacle here. Why don't we all just wait and find out what's going on with this TC before we start bashing it?

I'm sorry if I sound like I'm ranting, no hard feelings towards anyone involved. But I don't see how the Nova communtiy can attract new developers if we are so hostile towards them.

Well, there's my 2 cents. As for a name, I like Collapse ADA without the ADA.

Good luck.

It's been years since I posted here, been lurking for a while, but I just wanted to chip in and mention something, make a general point...

Seems to me a big part of enjoying the EV games, apart from playing them on my computer, was dreaming up things I'd do with the engine. I'd think all of you would understand this, because we’ve all been in the same boat. Of course there are a few exceptions, people who've actually finished a bunch of plugs like Bomb (back when I joined the boards he was Bombcat) and Martin Turner. Sure, I never completed one of the many projects I started. Can't say I'm proud about that. Feel a bit ridiculous, actually. Of course it still might happen. I've got a whole load of good stuff on my hard drive and I’ve got this great idea But to tell the truth, it was never really about producing a mod other people could play. It was about having a license to dream up my own little games. So while this poll is definitely pretty silly, I cast my vote in the ‘let’s take it easy on people like ScratSkinner’ column. He's just playing the game; we've all played it that way.

Used to be, sonny, back when I was a youth, we didn' have the privileges you young folks take for granted today. We had ‘a make do with what we were given. Walked uphill to school both ways, in the sleet ‘n snow, temper’tures approaching absolute zero, in nothin’ but a loin cloth, carryin’ our books on our back. Boy they weighted a ton. And you know what, we enjoyed it.

That, ‘n we were a bit more civil to newcomers. We encouraged people to work on their plugs, welcomed them to the boards ‘n said: "good luck. Ask for any help if’n you need it. Here’s hopin’ you finish yer plug because it sounds mighty cool and I need more ways to waste my precious time on God’s earth."

Least ways other people did that. I was never really a big 'un for bein' nice to furiners.

But nevertheless, we need more o' that old time courtesy 'round here abouts.

two cents.

Bubbles

This post has been edited by Bubbles : 15 March 2006 - 09:36 PM

Wow, it is indeed long-time-no-see, Bubbles. Welcome back.

Thanks Mazca. As I say I've been lurking for a while. There are a lot of clever people who post here these days. I hope some of these fantastic projects get finished. Have to say I'm especially looking forward to SFA.

By the way, do you all know that the developers corner is basically Mazca's baby? Isn't that right? Back when there were just two much simpler official bulletin boards, one for Escape Velocity and one for EVO, he had set up a developers corner of his own. I think I actually still have the address in my address book. When Ambrosia set up this whole system of UBB boards, they took over Mazca's idea and made an official developers site. At least, that's how I thought it happened at the time.

I'll probably just sink back into obscurity now.

Oh, and to justify posting on this thread: I like both 'Collapse' and 'Shattering', nice dramatic images. But what is it that's collapsing or shattering and why?

Bubbles