What i would like to see in missions

I hear so many say EVN needs balance. Well, here ya go. Balance. from a Mission perspective.

C'mon, you know what I mean when I say EV missions are a tad... hard to credit from an economic sense right?

Nova is a lot better than regular EV, but not by much. If, say, trading Med Supplies gives you 600 credits per ton, and thus a potential profit of 9000 credits for a 15 ton run (never mind the fuel you use), why are people willing to pay you 10-18,000 credits to run 10-15 tons of medical supplies from one place to another.... rather unrealistic. (Now, the United Shipping missions.. those actually make sense.)

Basic shipping runs should pay half the profit you would make in doing such a run from a planet where the cost for that commodity is low to one where it is high. Or they should involve shipping items you cannot get as commodities, and might have actual specific value justifying their being shipped around.

Furthermore, while not all mission should be rush, being able to wait a year and then deliver is ridiculous. Non-rush missions should have 3-4 times the allotted time as rush, but should still have a time limit.

That is pretty much a basic game-play alteration, which, thought it might be tough on those accustomed to easy missions, would enhance game-play, IMHO.

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Now, for a more extended plug, I would advocate using some of the following ideas to spice up missions beyond lots of going to place to place with occasional combat.

LIES, LIES

Missions, especially ones that involve a bit more story, should also allow for the fact that honesty is far from a certainty in the Galaxy. Examples:

1. A mission to retrieve some valuable schematic or artifact might end without pay and text indicating that the employer has fled to the shipyard. The player can 'pursue' by selecting the shipyard, and receive an new mission that will tell them to disable a certain ship to capture their 'employer' and force him to either fork over the cash, or return the object, which could, in turn lead to another mission, in which the player must figure out what to do with the object (an option of say, returning it to the Federation or taking it to the Rebellion; or an option of either selling the object to the people your employer originally meant to fence it to, or offering it to a museum).

2. A mission where the option to cheat is given to the player. Example: The player is entrusted with the delivery of a valuable item, and told to first check at the bar at his/her destination, but to also look out for a message on the BBS if he she does not find anyone. In the bar, he/she will be accosted by someone offering to buy the item from him/her for several times the money originally offered in the mission. The player has the option of selling, or of refusing, and finding a BBS mission to deliver the item to it's rightful recipient somewhere else close-by. (adapted from the 'Demokratia' missions in The Frozen Heart)

OOPS

Missions that dump a problem on your lap. Example:

1. A seemingly innocent mission to deliver 10 tons of Tribbles goes horribly awry when the little buggers start multiplying on your ship.

2. A delivery of "medical supplies" turns out to be a drug run. Player is given option of handing the over for money or of turning the narcotic in to authorities. Either option can be followed by other missions, "Escape Narcotics Officers" for the first option, and "Bait for Drug Dealers" for the second.

3. The infamous "plague missions" from The Frozen Heart. Board a derelict catch space plague (You get both a mission bit that causes you to get a mission that causes you to get attacked anytime you land, and an outfit that makes your ship turn more slowly)

MILITARY

Mission strings based on you joining a military, rather than being some all-powerful Ory'hara. These strings would reflect the life of a military careerist. Ie, you get rank, and pay, and most missions are not optional, plus you are restricted to navy ships.

Mission 1: Fed recruitment

Offer Text: You find a recruiter for the Federation Military in the bar. He notices you and comes over. "We're a bit short on pilots for our Patrol Boats at the moment, and we're recruiting merchant skippers with past combat experience. So whaddaya say? You get a nice 50,000 credit enlistment bonus, and steady pay. We'll commission you straight to Lieutenant Junior Grade."

On Accept: "Great!" he says, "Head to <Return Stellar> in the <Return System> system for training." He pats you on the back, "Welcome to the Navy, <PN>"

On Refuse: "Well, if you ever feel like some steady work in service of your country, you can just talk to any recruiter you meet," he tells you, before ambling off to find someone else to deliver his pitch to.

On Arrival: You are greeted on arrival by a young spacer wearing Federation Blues. "Report to the Shipyard," he tells you, "Instructor Allen will be waiting"

This mission grants:
Ship: Federation Scoutship -Trainer-
Outfit: Heavy Weapons License, Missile Weapons License
Honors: Cadet - 10 credits per day

Mission 2: Basic Combat Instruction

Enemies: Pirate Vipers x 8

Allies: Federation Scoutship -Trainer- x 3

After a few more training missions:

Mission 5: Graduation

"Congratulations on graduating. Your Squadron assignments are as follows:".
You eagerly scan down the list of names. You have been assigned to Delta squadron, along with Ben Faulken, Ashley Varre, and G: Ethan Renalt B: Elizabeth Mason, who has helped you. . .

You are to be posted to (Spacedock)

This mission grants:
Ship: Federation Gunboat -Close Quarters Variant-
Outfit: Protective Tech License
Honors: Lieutenant Jr Grade - 60 credits per day (replaces Cadet)

Mission 6: Compete for Squadron Leader Status

On Succeed: Bit X, permanent mission called "Lead Delta Squadron, which gives you 3 escorting Federation Gunboat -Close Quarters Variant-, and the honor "Lieutenant - 75 credits per day. (replaces Lieutenant Junior Grade)

On Fail: Bit X

All subsequent Fed Missions are for "Delta Squadron

After this:

Combat missions at Federation Stellars to defend <Return Stellar> are 15% and non-optional and non-abort-able.

Scout, Strike, and Escort missions for Fed Navy Appear in the Mission BBS

Non-optional Scout, Strike, and Escort missions appear at 5 %

Periodic (Cron), or Kill based Missions for "Evaluative Review" that grant higher rank.

Option to transfer to Capital ships after achieving "Commander" rank.

Further plot based missions.

These missions are:
Hard? Yes. Pain in the Neck? Maybe. Realistic? Darn straight!

A lot of these ideas are very similar to the ones I have in plan for Retribution and Sephil Saga. They're very good suggestions, and can be taken even further with a bit of creativity.

Good suggestions, especially on how to make missions more realistic in terms of pay and deadline. Heh, I also liked your idea on medical supplies turning out to be drugs, nice twist.
Many of those ideas on the general ways to improve missions so they aren't just plain and dull transport cargo missions are ones I have thought about as well.
Hmm, new boards still don't have a <cryptic grin> smiley yet, huh?
-_-

This post has been edited by WraithSniper : 25 September 2004 - 09:09 PM

Satori, on Sep 26 2004, 12:31 AM, said:

I hear so many say EVN needs balance. Well, here ya go. Balance. from a Mission perspective.

C'mon, you know what I mean when I say EV missions are a tad... hard to credit from an economic sense right?

Nova is a lot better than regular EV, but not by much. If, say, trading Med Supplies gives you 600 credits per ton, and thus a potential profit of 9000 credits for a 15 ton run (never mind the fuel you use), why are people willing to pay you 10-18,000 credits to run 10-15 tons of medical supplies from one place to another.... rather unrealistic. (Now, the United Shipping missions.. those actually make sense.)

View Post

You can´t really compare NOVA money to the any currenccy in the world today, thats just wrong. A huge inflation or something like that, and you´ll be at nova level..

And 10-18 000 isn´t really that much for medical supplies.. Which can be worth as much or more as anything.

And remember that those with a spacecraft has a lot of power in NOVA.. They are the only ones able to transport. I bet companies like sigma cooperate with others to put prices much higher then they need to be..

Satori, on Sep 26 2004, 01:31 AM, said:

Nova is a lot better than regular EV, but not by much. View Post

What the hell does that mean?

Quote

You can´t really compare NOVA money to the any currenccy in the world today, thats just wrong. A huge inflation or something like that, and you´ll be at nova level..

He's not comparing NOVA money to anything. He's just saying that if you can sell medical goods at X price from systems A to B, a mission telling you to carry the same amount of medical goods from system A to B should not cost 10X or an even higher price.

I have two comments:
- first, when you are transporting a "cargo", it isn't the same as the junk resource, so it doesn't multiply (already tried). So forget the "tribble problem" idea.

- secondly, I agree most are good ideas, and have to admit I am already using quite a few of them in Arpia 2 (where you can choose your future for example ).

<cryptic grin>

UE_Research & Development, on Sep 26 2004, 12:30 PM, said:

He's not comparing NOVA money to anything. He's just saying that if you can sell medical goods at X price from systems A to B, a mission telling you to carry the same amount of medical goods from system A to B should not cost 10X or an even higher price.
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oh well misunderstood that part..sorry..

but still.. those missions are urgent, it´s like the difference between sending something with a private company or through the mail...

That might cost 10X the price..

modesty_blaise_us, on Sep 26 2004, 06:32 PM, said:

oh well misunderstood that part..sorry..

but still.. those missions are urgent, it´s like the difference between sending something with a private company or through the mail...

That might cost 10X the price..
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If they were 'urgent', they would set deadlines, not give the pilot a century and a half to deliver 'luxury goods' or whatever, unlike the majority of cargo-delivery missions you can get.

(tangent)I hate the new roll-eyes smiley. It doesn't convey the disdain the old one did.(/tangent)

This post has been edited by UE_Research & Development: 26 September 2004 - 01:34 PM

UE_Research & Development, on Sep 26 2004, 01:34 PM, said:

If they were 'urgent', they would set deadlines, not give the pilot a century and a half to deliver 'luxury goods' or whatever, unlike the majority of cargo-delivery missions you can get.

(tangent)I hate the new roll-eyes smiley. It doesn't convey the disdain the old one did.(/tangent)
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Well at least someone gets my point. Thanks UE

Pace (haldora), on Sep 26 2004, 12:31 PM, said:

I have two comments:
- first, when you are transporting a "cargo", it isn't the same as the junk resource, so it doesn't multiply (already tried). So forget the "tribble problem" idea.

Please. As if there's no other way to do it. It's called workarounds. Did he say anything about a junk? Now, it wouldn't be quite as accurate, but it can be done easily.

I feel they are more urgent, I actually feel an obligation to finish a mission in EV NOVA.. Even if it has no exp date..

modesty_blaise_us, on Sep 26 2004, 08:19 PM, said:

I feel they are more urgent, I actually feel an obligation to finish a mission in EV NOVA.. Even if it has no exp date..
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When I develop a plug-in, I don't really care what obligations you in particular might happen to feel, but I do care about what makes sense in the context of the plug-in.

:vehement roll-eyes smiley:

orcaloverbri9, on Sep 26 2004, 08:35 PM, said:

Please. As if there's no other way to do it. It's called workarounds. Did he say anything about a junk? Now, it wouldn't be quite as accurate, but it can be done easily.
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How do you do it then? Have a silent mission that gives the player another ton or two whenever he does something (like start mission x when you observe ship y)? Or am I completely off?

BTW, I think rush deliveries and especially United Shipping missions should make it mandatory that you bring the cargo to destination, even if you don't meet the deadline, instead of having the all important papers "poof" into nothingness, and at arival after deadline you get no pay or minimal to-cover-fuel-expenses pay. And if you jettison the cargo or abort the mission, you're fired, as simple as that (I think jetisonning automatically aborts the missions, but I could be wrong).

I agree with everything, and especially that we can make things a lot more interesting by making things not as they appear. I think we have much to learn from people doing RPGs and RPG scenarios. Mind you, we have some just below (Coldstone). We should exchange ideas a bit more (between two topics where they bitch about Beenox not being on the level).

All great ideas and similar to my line of thinking in SS. There are NO generic cargo runs in SS- partly due to the fact that random selection of destinations in questionable at best, but mostly because WHY? Why, in a universe full of bonded, licenced, quick and efficient shipping companies, would somebody hire an independent captain to haul 10 tons of goods for them? Unless, of course, there's more to it than meets the eye. There are cargo runs in SS, however, they happen to be on the bad side of the law generally, and always have time limits (with repercussions for failing). I'm working on a sort of Shadowrun-esque setup. Basically, except for a few more or less random drug mule or illegal tribble runs, you have to know somebody to get this kind of work regularly- your Mr. Johnson in Shadowrun terms.

In other areas, the economy has been changed dramatically. For one, ships (especially external-frame cargo ships) generally have a LOT more cargo room, making it much more easily for players to go for an economy of scale early on- basically making cargo running on your own (no mission) much better and more attractive. Second, the prices of the commodities have been played with quite radically. First, they have been multiplied by about 10+, and then differentiated based on what the commodity is. A ton (not a good measure, but we're kind of stuck with it) of Biotech goods can cost you 20000+ (which will probably be raised in Alpha testing), while a ton of metal might cost a few hundred- which makes sense if you know anything about mining.

All this stuff seems to get overlooked quite often in the process of making a plug, but I think it can add alot of realism, as well as being an effective setting-enhancer.

Masamune, on Sep 27 2004, 11:10 AM, said:

All great ideas and similar to my line of thinking in SS. There are NO generic cargo runs in SS- partly due to the fact that random selection of destinations in questionable at best, but mostly because WHY? Why, in a universe full of bonded, licenced, quick and efficient shipping companies, would somebody hire an independent captain to haul 10 tons of goods for them? Unless, of course, there's more to it than meets the eye. There are cargo runs in SS, however, they happen to be on the bad side of the law generally, and always have time limits (with repercussions for failing). I'm working on a sort of Shadowrun-esque setup. Basically, except for a few more or less random drug mule or illegal tribble runs, you have to know somebody to get this kind of work regularly- your Mr. Johnson in Shadowrun terms.

In other areas, the economy has been changed dramatically. For one, ships (especially external-frame cargo ships) generally have a LOT more cargo room, making it much more easily for players to go for an economy of scale early on- basically making cargo running on your own (no mission) much better and more attractive. Second, the prices of the commodities have been played with quite radically. First, they have been multiplied by about 10+, and then differentiated based on what the commodity is. A ton (not a good measure, but we're kind of stuck with it) of Biotech goods can cost you 20000+ (which will probably be raised in Alpha testing), while a ton of metal might cost a few hundred- which makes sense if you know anything about mining.

All this stuff seems to get overlooked quite often in the process of making a plug, but I think it can add alot of realism, as well as being an effective setting-enhancer.
View Post

Sounds great.

You wouldn't happen to need a writter for this plug-in would you?

We definitely do. Come over to www.zhouj.net/Forum and tell us more about yourself if you're interested ;).

Pace (haldora), on Sep 27 2004, 06:21 AM, said:

How do you do it then? Have a silent mission that gives the player another ton or two whenever he does something (like start mission x when you observe ship y)? Or am I completely off?

I was thinking of a cron, actually.

Hmm...you know, I can't help but wonder if there's a bit of naming inspiration from the UNIX program cron in the cron resource...they both perform the same basic task...

I remember reading through the descriptions for the "Angels of Vengeance" plug-in for Classic. This topic reminds me of my reaction to that.

It just seemed as if everybody was throwing money at you to do what they wanted; it made no sense that people desperate to protect their planet would run into the bar, literally begging for help and willing to pay whatever odd sums.

This prompted me to write up a reactionary piece; the very beginning of a string where the player gets drafted into military service.

----------
You are looking over what's available at the shipyard, when dozens of {bxxx "officers of the <military> come marching in" "the local military types bust in"} and begin harassing the dock master. At first you are curious, and go over to find out what's going on. It isn't long before you regret it.

"But I can't just let you take these ships!" the dock master cries.

"By the order of <leader>, sir, these ships have all been commandeered by the <military>. You can comply willingly, or we can force you." Some of the other soldiers begin accosting the other pilots and buyers.

"You!" one of them grabs you. "You fly? You pilot?" you nod. "Good. Come with me." You are practically dragged before a commander.

"{bxxy "<PN>?" He says upon seeing you "I've heard of you. "}The <enemy> are attacking," he says by way of introduction. "By order of <leader>, you've just been drafted into the service of the <military>. You will be expected to..."

Before he can continue, another officer comes running up. "Sir! Commodore Vorren tells us we've got a <decent capital ship> that we need a pilot for. He needs to know if you've got anyone."

The commander turns to you. "You have a ship?"

This could be an opportunity for you to con your way onto a decent capital ship. On the other hand, your thoughts turn to the <PSN>; if you don't secure her soon, in a crisis like this, you'll probably never see her again.

Accept: I have a ship. (Set: Hxxz.)

Reject: I'm available.
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I'm leaving a lot of proper nouns out of this text:

<military> : Think along the lines of the "United Nations Space Force Fleet", or the "People's Liberation Armada" to fill this gap.
<leader> : Elvis; cuz' only "The King" can demand this.
<decent capital ship> : A Corvette, or a Manticore. Probably somewhere in between.