I pretty much figured out all of the texturing features in Infini-D last year, but I've yet been able to activate an alpha mask layer. I've created several "textures" in Photoshop (black as the background, white sections as what I want to show up), and loaded them in Infini-D. But the small "alpha mask" check box fails to show up... it's grayed out. Anyone have some feedback as to what I'm doing wrong?

Any help is appreciated. Live long and prosper.

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Most likely, you added an alpha channel to your photoshop textures. Also, you need to make sure that when you save, you save in 32, not 24 bit. The reason for this is that in a 24 bit file, you have 8 bits for each color, 8 for red, 8 for green, and 8 for blue. 24 bits. A 32 bit file adds an extra 8 bits for alpha channel, 8 red, 8 green, 8 blue, and 8 alpha. This is pretty much what happens for all software packages, and isn't limited to just Infini-D, so that's what I assume is going on.

Skyblade, I assume that you know what an alpha channel does, but this is for people reading this post who don't. An alpha channel is 8 bits that say how visible a pixel is. Generally, a white alpha channel pixel will be completely visible, a gray pixel will be partially visible (with the underlying texture, or whatever partially visible as well), and a black alpha channel pixel will be completely transparent. The alpha channel is useful for using layered textures. One possible use for this is to texture a ship in "pristine" condition, and then layering a "rust and grime" texture on top.

Matrix

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"Nothing is fool-proof to a sufficiently talented fool."

(This message has been edited by what_is_the_matrix (edited 05-17-2002).)

Right. Matrix pretty much covered it all.

My take on it:

It sounds like you're trying to create a normal image to use as an alpha mask. What the check box does is enable the alpha mask in an image map. The alpha mask is a 4th 8-bit channel in addition to the normal 24-bits of an image. It controls the visibility of the image, like Matrix said.

What this means in Infini-D is that you can control what areas and how much of the lower layers show through an image map layer which uses an alpha mask. Grime, details, scored or charred patches, lines, and decals with non-rectangular edges are all prime examples of using alpha masks. For example, the Confed logo pict I sent you has a white circle in its alpha mask, so only a circle will show when using its alpha mask rather than the whole rectangular image.

I hope that helps.

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Say, tell me, are you using MetaTools Infini-D 4 or Specular Infini-D 3? I use MetaTools and in my line of work, I've never used the alpha mask features cause I've been making mask by making all elements of my ships all white.

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Nosumus Fortiolis Quad Volimus

Thanks for the feedback everyone, but I've always saved my textures in 32-bit color (and pict format). Nevertheless, I've never managed to activate the alpha mask in Infini-D. I certainly know what an alpha mask does (I'm trying to apply some ID numbers to my current project as well as a logo), but no luck.

So I need to get rid of my alpha channels in Photoshop?

Coraxus: I'm using MetaCreation's Infini-D 4.5.

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Quote

Originally posted by Coraxus:
**Say, tell me, are you using MetaTools Infini-D 4 or Specular Infini-D 3? I use MetaTools and in my line of work, I've never used the alpha mask features cause I've been making mask by making all elements of my ships all white.

**

Coraxus, he wasn't talking about making ship sprite masks , those are easy, he was talking about alpha channels. They're two completely different things. Sprite masks are easy, turning the ship white is one method, but alpha channel is very different. An alpha channel is generally used when making a texture that has irregular, or even feathered (soft) edges. As I said above, the part of the alpha channel that is white is perfectly visible, while the part of the alpha channel is black is perfectly in visible. You use textures with alpha channels in conjunction with other textures, basically, layering textures. This creates the illusion of say, a rusty ship, without having to mess up your original texture file by making it rusty.

Matrix

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"Nothing is fool-proof to a sufficiently talented fool."

Quote

Originally posted by Captain Skyblade:
**Thanks for the feedback everyone, but I've always saved my textures in 32-bit color (and pict format). Nevertheless, I've never managed to activate the alpha mask in Infini-D. I certainly know what an alpha mask does (I'm trying to apply some ID numbers to my current project as well as a logo), but no luck.

So I need to get rid of my alpha channels in Photoshop?
**

Actually, you need to keep the alpha channel in to make use of them in Infini-D. Perhaps .pict format is incompatible with alpha channels in Infini-D. Try saving your texture in a whole bunch of different formats, and testing them in Infini-D to see which works. After that, I'm not sure what you could do... I'll keep thinking about it, but again, try other formats.

Matrix

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"Nothing is fool-proof to a sufficiently talented fool."

Noooo...pict is just fine. I use them all the time.

Cpt. Skyblade: When you load the image into Infini-D, is the menu for alpha channel type set to "straight", not "multiplied" or "none"?

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Quote

Originally posted by Weepul 884:
**Noooo...pict is just fine. I use them all the time.

Cpt. Skyblade: When you load the image into Infini-D, is the menu for alpha channel type set to "straight", not "multiplied" or "none"?

**

My older brother just told me that pict format doesn't support alpha channels, even if it saves in 32-bit color. He said to use targa format, and it should work. I'm going to try that later today and see if I get anywhere. Might simply be a problem with my Photoshop preference settings for pict files...

About your last question, I just leave those options alone (default setting, which I think is "none").

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Pict DOES support alpha channels. I speak from first-hand experience.

If a PICT has an alpha channel, Infini-D usually defaults to "straight", but if it doesn't, make sure you set it to "straight". The menu is greyed out if the image does not have an alpha channel.

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Quote

Originally posted by Weepul 884:
**Pict DOES support alpha channels. I speak from first-hand experience.

If a PICT has an alpha channel, Infini-D usually defaults to "straight", but if it doesn't, make sure you set it to "straight". The menu is greyed out if the image does not have an alpha channel.

**

Ok, I've done more experimenting with my 32-bit color pict files, and the default setting is straight. But this is the very setting that greys out the alpha channel option. If I try "multiplied," the alpha channel box is activated, but the white isn't very transparent... only bump maps on textures beneath it show through.

Grrrr... this is frustrating. I'm going to hack Infini-D to pieces.

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"Everything we know tells us that machines are structures intelligence designs, and that accidents destroy. Therefore, accidents do not design machines. Intellect does. And the myriad of biological wonders that sprinkle our world testify to the design ingenuity of a Supreme Intellect." -Robert Gange, Origins of Destiny

What? That's odd...

Don't use "multiplied", it's some weird option that works with some abnormal way of making alpha masks, I think. "Straight" has always worked for me. Are you sure that, when you load an image with alpha mask set to straight, the "use alpha mask" checkbox is greyed out?

I'd send you an example file to show you that it's possible, but for some reason I've been unable to upload to my web space.

Oh, wait: I already have an example uploaded. Do you remember (url="http://"http://www.2xtreme.net/btaenzer/texturingexamples.sit")http://www.2xtreme.n...ingexamples.sit(/url) ? Check out the composed texture "fancy schmancy" and the image maps it uses.

Hopefully it'll work for you...if it doesn't, maybe something's wrong with your copy of Infini-D.

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Quote

Originally posted by Weepul 884:
**What? That's odd...

Don't use "multiplied", it's some weird option that works with some abnormal way of making alpha masks, I think. "Straight" has always worked for me. Are you sure that, when you load an image with alpha mask set to straight, the "use alpha mask" checkbox is greyed out?

I'd send you an example file to show you that it's possible, but for some reason I've been unable to upload to my web space.

Oh, wait: I already have an example uploaded. Do you remember http://www.2xtreme.n...ingexamples.sit ? Check out the composed texture "fancy schmancy" and the image maps it uses.

Hopefully it'll work for you...if it doesn't, maybe something's wrong with your copy of Infini-D.

**

There you go... just by looking at your files in Photoshop, I was finally able to get my own alpha masks to work, and find out how to add worn effects (with grey). Thanks a thousand times, Weep. This will be a great help in the future.

/demands that a mod give Weepul a karma point.

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Well, don't leave us hanging! What was the problem?

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I recommend you also use Graphic Converter for making alpha channels, as well. Graphic Converter is quite a useful tool.

-Kevin

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(quote)Originally posted by Weepul 884:
**;) Some of my Photoshop preferences weren't set correctly as far as color channels are concerned, and I also had the greyscale transparency wrong: black is transparent in Infini-D, not white (I was thinking it was the other way around). Of course, I could simply invert the alpha mask in Infini-D, but I totally forgot to try that. I was also originally opening the textures and setting them to "multiple" insetad of "straight."

Simply looking through your Infini-D and PS texture documents explained a lot, especially as far as cool wear effects are concerned. Many thanks.

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"Everything we know tells us that machines are structures intelligence designs, and that accidents destroy. Therefore, accidents do not design machines. Intellect does. And the myriad of biological wonders that sprinkle our world testify to the design ingenuity of a Supreme Intellect." -Robert Gange, Origins of Destiny

Ahhh, ok, I see. About your comment, though, that "Of course, I could simply invert the alpha mask in Infini-D", you can't. The invert checkbox in the composed texture editor inverts the color portion, not the mask. Yes, I'm sure.

So, yeah, wear effects on decals and logos and other paint-type things are one major use of alpha masks. Also, you can make a good dirt, grime, charring, etc. type overlay by making a complex alpha mask for a black (or black and dark brown) image.

Weep's Tip Of The Moment™:

They're also good for local details, like windows (especially for bridges/cockpits, to reduce model complexity), but then you usually have to split your object into two, so the texture doesn't show on the bottom when applied as "straight" (as opposed to cylindrical, or whatever). For example:

The cockpit is just a black image map layer using an alpha mask, set to 100% surface, 100% specularity, 0% glossiness, and about 10% reflection (FYI, in Infini-D, for effect layers, black = full effect, like full transparency, full glow, or full reflectiveness). The cockpit part is only 1 object.
(as seen in the Ship Design Contest 2000 held by R&R;)

The way I made it was I took a screenshot of the object in the object editor, of the camera view set to front (or whatever was the "top" view) and resized to fill the screen, and set the view type to orthagonal as opposed to perspective. Then, I used that as a template in Photoshop.

Have fun, now that you've got it working!

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(This message has been edited by Weepul 884 (edited 05-23-2002).)

Quote

Originally posted by Captain Skyblade:
**long story. Some of my Photoshop preferences weren't set correctly as far as color channels are concerned, and I also had the greyscale transparency wrong: black is transparent in Infini-D, not white (I was thinking it was the other way around).
**

Didn't I say that black is transparent and white is opaque? Yes I did. If you think about it, when you have rgb, when the value of r is at its highest, it's red (100% red), and when it's 0, it's black (0% red). In the alpha channel when its value is at its highest, it's 100% visible, and when its value is at its lowest, it's 0% visible.

Matrix

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"Nothing is fool-proof to a sufficiently talented fool."

Guess I was mislead about inverting alpha masks. That's why it never worked when I tried in the past (Squinky had said some time ago that it would work, or maybe I misunderstood him). I did notice a difference with colors, though.

That caution strip's alpha mask was perfect in showing how to make wear and tear. I've been basing many of my alpha mask on that strip's basic style, and have had some awesome results. Also works great for worn text such as ship ID numbers.

Ahh, I remember that fighter of yours... very cool (looks like a nasty Manta). I can't remember if it actually won the contest or grabbed second. Didn't David from Meowx Design place first with that X-Wing?

That's awesome how you modelled that cockpit... I was thinking you had made it using booleans. I had made an attempt in the past to make a cockpit nearly the exact same way as you did (taking a screenshot of the object and using it as a base image for an alpha mask), but as you know, I couldn't get the masks to work then. I'll try that out again soon.

I noticed the rocket flame from that weapon in the foreground. Did you add that in Photoshop, or was that a light applied in Infini-D (if so, I'm assuming you used something other then the tubelight, which is about the only one I've messed around with).

Believe me, I've having plenty of fun.

matrix: I never said you didn't say that... I just didn't read what you said close enough. Squinky had me really thrown off track when he told me a good year or so ago that the alpha mask worked the other way around. But then again, he also said he had the world's worst memory.

Thanks again for all the help.

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"Everything we know tells us that machines are structures intelligence designs, and that accidents destroy. Therefore, accidents do not design machines. Intellect does. And the myriad of biological wonders that sprinkle our world testify to the design ingenuity of a Supreme Intellect." -Robert Gange, Origins of Destiny

Originally posted by Captain Skyblade:

That caution strip's alpha mask was perfect in showing how to make wear and tear. I've
been basing many of my alpha mask on that strip's basic style, and have had some awesome
results. Also works great for worn text such as ship ID numbers.

Actually, credit for that goes to David of Meowx. I took one of his texture maps from the Texture Depot (I believe) which had a worn warning stripe as part of the image map. I carefully removed it. He's a master of imitating wearing in image maps, I believe...moreso than I.

Ahh, I remember that fighter of yours... very cool (looks like a nasty Manta). I can't
remember if it actually won the contest or grabbed second. Didn't David from Meowx Design
place first with that X-Wing?

Heh. (url="http://"http://www.mso.anu.edu.au/~ralph/rodger/evocomp.html")Actually(/url), that got second, and my OTHER ship got first. Meowx's X-Wing got the Ambrosia's Choice award.

That's awesome how you modelled that cockpit... (snip) I'll try that out again soon.

Ah, but the beauty of it is, it's not modelling.

I noticed the rocket flame from that weapon in the foreground. Did you add that in
Photoshop, or was that a light applied in Infini-D (if so, I'm assuming you used
something other then the tubelight, which is about the only one I've messed around with).

That was a spotlight. (A spotlight's glow is, of course, a cone, with falloff and softness options.)

The smoke trail was a particle emitter with the Fast Blur filter applied (fully functional gotten from a demo of After Effects) and composited in Photoshop (because Infini-D doesn't like raytracing filters, so the smoke was captured in wireframe mode).

Thanks again for all the help.

Anytime.

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(This message has been edited by Weepul 884 (edited 05-24-2002).)