Non-Nova mainly 'cos I have to wait for international mail.... Its EVO 1.0.2

Anyway.

I have a bar mission which involves an offer, a briefing and picking up some cargo (and, obviously, delivering it).

It shows the offer and briefing text, but not the load cargo text. Is this normal? If I run the mission through everything else works perfectly. For story telling purposes it would be quite efficient if the load cargo text showed.

Cheers (and I'm suitably impressed at anyone who actually manages to tear themselves away from Nova to answer)

------------------

Nah, I'm at my mom's office because she has a mad-l33t internet connection so I am not playing Nova.

Hm..I know that it can't show three text screens initially, that is showing the offer, briefing, and cargo loading all in one, but as for landing ELSEWHERE to get it, I suppose that this would not work if the dëscs weren't coordinated with the contents of the mďsn resources.

-Nat

------------------
Lequis Design
lequis.netfirms.com
PhantoM_63ff@hotmail.com

Quote

Originally posted by Lequis MX:
**Hm..I know that it can't show three text screens initially, that is showing the offer, briefing, and cargo loading all in one, but as for landing ELSEWHERE to get it, I suppose that this would not work if the dëscs weren't coordinated with the contents of the mďsn resources.

-Nat
**

Cheers - it looked like that was the case. I'll have to break it into two missions. Not as crisp but the story needs to move along at this point, so needs must. There'll be enough red herrings elsewhere.

------------------

Quote

Originally posted by Aitch:
**Cheers - it looked like that was the case. I'll have to break it into two missions. Not as crisp but the story needs to move along at this point, so needs must. There'll be enough red herrings elsewhere.

**

Why 2 missions? Is there some sumpremely important reason that the cargo cannot be picked up somewhere besides the place where the mission is offered and then delivered to its destination? It might require some reworking of the description text, but seems simpler than adding another mission. But it's your plug, do what you want.

------------------
Joe Burnette
"I find that humans can be divided into only two meaningful categories: Decent Humans and Sonsofbitches; both types appear to be evenly distributed
among all shapes, colors, sizes, and nationalities." -- Keith Laumer

Quote

Originally posted by Joe Burnette:
Why 2 missions? Is there some sumpremely important reason that the cargo cannot be picked up somewhere besides the place where the mission is offered and then delivered to its destination?

Do you know, I think that is probably the single most important question in plug development? I'm not being sarcastic - you are basically asking 'why do some things here and in this way?'

To answer your specific query - it is about exactly when the player 'turns over the page', to create the right atrmosphere (defined in an EV mission context, I suppose, as 'what happens before and immediately after you click the OK button') .

Breaking it into two at this point kills the pace slightly (but only slightly) but keeps the page turn in the right place. Tweaking the descs and moving the pick-up killed the writing quality AND the pace by putting the 'page turn' in the wrong place. So it is the lesser of two evils.

Since the plug is not a science fiction story (it just happens to be set in a science fiction universe) the page turning has to be as close to just right as is possible.

Hope that is suitably ellipical. Thanks for the thinking exercise (again, no sarcasm - I mean it).

(As an aside the whole idea for the plug was inspired by a single, brilliantly timed, desc in Femme Fatale. That the plug has proved rather more ambitious than I originally expected may or may not explain why I am being a tad cautious of giving details)

------------------

Quote

Originally posted by Aitch:
**Do you know, I think that is probably the single most important question in plug development? I'm not being sarcastic - you are basically asking 'why do some things here and in this way?'
**

Well, being a lazy sort, I generally look for the simplest/easiest way to accomplish a given task

Quote

**
To answer your specific query - it is about exactly when the player 'turns over the page', to create the right atrmosphere (defined in an EV mission context, I suppose, as 'what happens before and immediately after you click the OK button')...
**

That is certainly a suprermely important reason.
No doubt I'm belaboring the obvious here, but depending on what needs to be occurring in the game "universe" at a particular point in the story, there are other places where the 'turn of the page' could occur, especially at mission end where the 'drop cargo' and 'completion' descs can appear in sequence - and if necessary lead immediately into another mission so there is little break (two mouse clicks) between the one and the other. And of course the 'cargo' descs can be made to appear without the player even being aware he is carrying cargo - or for that matter other mission texts appearing without the player necessarily being aware he is performing a mission.

Quote

**
Since the plug is not a science fiction story (it just happens to be set in a science fiction universe)...
**

No sarcasm intended, I'd be intersted to know how you can have a story that is not science fiction set in a science fiction universe.

Quote

**
..Thanks for the thinking exercise..
**

You're welcome.
Better to cause others to think than to do it oneself.

Quote

**
(As an aside the whole idea for the plug was inspired by a single, brilliantly timed, desc in Femme Fatale...
**

That and your earlier comments convince me that your plug, whatever it is, will be well worth waiting for and playing.

------------------
Joe Burnette
"I find that humans can be divided into only two meaningful categories: Decent Humans and Sonsofbitches; both types appear to be evenly distributed
among all shapes, colors, sizes, and nationalities." -- Keith Laumer

**

Quote

Originally posted by Joe Burnette:
That and your earlier comments convince me that your plug, whatever it is, will be well worth waiting for and playing.

**

(quote)Originally posted by Aitch:
****No pressure then....

(quote) **
...Ultimately it is mainly about prefered writing style, and at this specific point about pacing (and perhaps about the balance between thowing a curve ball at the player and being unfair).
****(/quote)

Unfair? First you have to define what is fair and what is unfair - and there will always be some who disagree with whatever you decide. I am all for throwing the player a few curves now and again, for making him have to pause and think things through, and perhaps even for somewhat arbitrarily killing off his pilot occasionally just to be sure he is paying attention.

(quote) **
Y'know. Come to think of it, Asimov's Foundation Trilogy (the original one that is) would make a damned fine plug-in mileau...
**(/quote)

Indeed. I believe it has been done, or at least attempted, but I don't recall ever seeing the plug. A drawback, of course is that the main story is known, so your player would have to become involved in some sort of peripheral action rather than participating directly in the major events.

(quote)(b)
Oh! God! Am I ever going to earn a living again?
**(/quote)

Being unable to speak for the Deity, I won't touch that one

As for the topic wandering, it seems to me we are still dicussing plug-in development, though in somewhat broader terms that usual. If we stray too far afield, the mods will no doubt inform us of our error.

------------------
Joe Burnette
"I find that humans can be divided into only two meaningful categories: Decent Humans and Sonsofbitches; both types appear to be evenly distributed
among all shapes, colors, sizes, and nationalities." -- Keith Laumer

Storyline, as conveyed primarily through the desc's in the game, is vital. The more work I do on my plug-in the more work I have to do on foundational issues not related to the actual programming. For example, I have a brief two page summary of major corporations that exist in my universe - and that's just the ones responsible for manufacturing ships that appear in the game. Then you get into multiple contacts and branching storylines between governments, and even within governments. So far, without writing a single misn resource so far, I'm estimating I'll use close to 200. And I'm probably underestimating.

------------------
Gage Stryker

This post is subject to all the protections and benifits of the posting code
It's coming - (url="http://"http://www26.brinkster.com/bdprod/index.html")Visible Menace for EVO!(/url) Current as of 03/12/02 | | v 0.2.5 | | 11.7 MB | | 41% to Beta

Quote

Originally posted by Joe Burnette:
**Indeed. I believe it (Foundation) has been done, or at least attempted, but I don't recall ever seeing the plug. A drawback, of course is that the main story is known, so your player would have to become involved in some sort of peripheral action rather than participating directly in the major events.

**

I have to respectfully disagree. Your logic here implies that you could not make a movie of a novel... (think about it). The issue, surely, would be not 'do you know the story?', but 'did you enjoy living the story?' And The Mule would make a truly fascinating pers.... (not to mention the fact that many of the young whipper snappers 'round these parts probably haven't discovered the utter delight that is genre defining 1940s SF )

**

Quote

Unfair? First you have to define what is fair and what is unfair - and there will always be some who disagree with whatever you decide. I am all for throwing the player a few curves now and again, for making him have to pause and think things through,

**

Quite agree - perhaps a more meaningful analogy would be a curve, compared with a beamer...

**

Quote

Sturgeon's comment can of course be applied to any genre. And to reverse your "classification" of various works, George Orwell's 1984 is usually considered social commentary but is certainly easily classifiable as science fiction. I thought I knew what you meant, but assumptions can be dangerous.

**

QED... (Oh good.. that means some of the willfully misleading stuff in the plug might just come off)

Now, a question I would appreciate your (and anyone else's) view on...

I have reached the stage where I could finish (relatively quickly) the central 'combat oriented' plotline. I have also tee'd up the, um. related (parallel?) mystery.

BUT there will have to be various side plots, diversions, red herrings, traps and general mischief making by the time it is finished.

In terms of keeping track of bits and stuff, do you think it best to crack through the central plot and back-fill the other stuff, or to try to do everything chronologically in roughly the sequence it is supposed to happen?

Gage Stryker: Oh! Yes! I thought I had the back-plot well thought through but have been surprised at how much it has developed. At this rate I might have to start making notes

------------------

(This message has been edited by Aitch (edited 03-22-2002).)