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Weepul 884 wrote:
shun Carrara until the "soon" promised patch comes out.
Actually, Metacreations dumped their entire product line a few days ago
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(url="http://"http://www.blackrockmac.com/ajm/sig.html")~AM~(/url)
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That's exactly what I wanted to know since there isn't a Macworld review. So what program SHOULD I set my sights on, Infini-D?
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"Landing request denied."- The Igadzra
Company Tritanium Enterprises: (url="http://"http://www.megalink.net/~joe1/w/")http://www.megalink.net/~joe1/w/(/url)
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LoneIgadzra wrote:
So what program SHOULD I set my sights on, Infini-D?I suppose, but you only can find the full vers on hotline, and the latest vers is 4.5.
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(url="http://"http://www.blackrockmac.com/ajm/sig.html")~AM~(/url) -
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Zeta wrote:
Youch! Can we say "winner"?! Those are great graphics. What program did you use?I'd like to know that too! looks at example and hiccups. "Most impressive" doesn't do justice to those!
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"Landing request denied."- The Igadzra
Company Tritanium Enterprises: (url="http://"http://www.megalink.net/~joe1/w/")http://www.megalink.net/~joe1/w/(/url)
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For those graphics I posted earlier, I used a little photoshop and RayDream 5.
Hey, skunkboi! Go poking around in directories a lot? You probably went to the index page of the main directory (http://web4.integrao...ckey/index.html, which has since been deleted), which only contains a few spin graphics. The ones that are questionable are the medship (where's the front?), shuttle and falcon (can you say pixelated?), and perhaps some others that were too dark, odd-looking, or just plain screwy. All of the ones that I mentioned (and more) have been re-rendered for much higher quality.
As a final note on that subject, that particular page was made while the plug was in its infancy, roughly six months ago. A few ships have had some dramatic changes since then.------------------
- () () / }{ -(formerly fatalin.tycho)
(url="http://"http://coldblood.cjb.net")Cold Blood(/url)
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Oh yeah, I'm back in the running. Check out my latest here:
(url="http://"http://www.crosswinds.net/~shadeofblue/scouter.html")http://www.crosswind...ue/scouter.html(/url)There isn't a background or anything, just the ship, but it still takes a while to load cause it's 640x480 and the highest quality jpg.
Cheers,
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-Shade(url="http://"http://www.crosswinds.net/~shadeofblue/")EV:O Revenge(/url)
"Science is like sex: sometimes something useful comes out, but that is not the reason we are doing it"
(url="http://"http://www.theonion.com")The Onion(/url)
(This message has been edited by ShadeOfBlue (edited 02-23-2000).)
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Onxy- Heh. Okay. I just hate getting confused, missing a few shots, wasting ammo/whatever, or running into a powerful ship..
I seriously wish I had the time to sit down with PS and a good program and work on something.. 7 hours a week on a PC doesnt cut it.
Rather, 7 hours cut into 3.5 hour chunks, in a classroom where I SHOULD be listening to someone.
~S~
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"All power corrupts, absolute power..."
"..is even more fun!""The meek shall inherit..."
"...what they're bloody well given. And be thankful for it."-BOFH, Simon talking to his PFY.
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ShadeOfBlue wrote:
**Check out my latest here:
http://www.crosswind...ue/scouter.html
**So what do you think?
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-Shade(url="http://"http://www.crosswinds.net/~shadeofblue/")EV:O Revenge(/url)
"Science is like sex: sometimes something useful comes out, but that is not the reason we are doing it"
(url="http://"http://www.theonion.com")The Onion(/url)
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ShadeOfBlue wrote:
http://www.crosswind...ue/scouter.htmlPretty cool, (almost) makes me want to buy RDS.
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(url="http://"http://www.blackrockmac.com/ajm/sig.html")~AM~(/url) -
I'm trying to make an outfit using Texture Maps and RD4 and I just can't seam to make the maps work right. I fiddle with existing maps (Onyx's) to get the effect I want and it just get more and more messed up and the way the thing is mapping seems just plain screwed up... (actually everything looks fine until I change something, the things start to get wierd.) I have had 2 (restart-requiring) crashes since I started this too. If RD4 were even 50% more stable and worked with Force Quit...
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"Landing request denied."- The Igadzra
Company Tritanium Enterprises: (url="http://"http://www.megalink.net/~joe1/w/")http://www.megalink.net/~joe1/w/(/url)
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ShadeOfBlue wrote:
Check out my latest here: http://www.crosswind...ue/scouter.htmlSo what do you think?
Not bad, the texture map looks kind of funny, with lines ending abruptly. It also looks to me like it'd be better as a bump map, than a texture map. Also, I've seen better texture maps, such as the available-for-use ones of Onyx's. Try the ones he used on the Valkyrie...most darned realistic-looking textures I've ever seen...
My synopsis: depending on your skill level, pretty good, though I'm not a-quakin' in my boots about the contest, no offense. Could use more detail and a different texture for the main, grey parts. It probably looks great in EV though, since detail is mostly lost in spin views unless the ship is huge.
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Weepul 884 wrote:
Not bad, the texture map looks kind of funny, with lines ending abruptly. It also looks to me like it'd be better as a bump map, than a texture map. Also, I've seen better texture maps, such as the available-for-use ones of Onyx's. Try the ones he used on the Valkyrie...most darned realistic-looking textures I've ever seen...Oh that's right, I forgot; staight lines are supposed to end in a graceful loop de loop. What was I thinking? You might also want to notice that is is also a bump map, and considering how picky you were, that should've been easy to notice. And about the second part: it should plainly be banned from the competition. Although true, you did make the model, textures are a big thing. You seem to be happy to say, "I downloaded somebodie elses free textures from so my ship looks great!" so would you be happy to say, "I downloaded somebodies elses free ship model and gave it a new paint job so now it looks great!"
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Weepul 884 wrote:
**My synopsis: depending on your skill level, pretty good, though I'm not a-quakin' in my boots about the contest, no offense. Could use more detail and a different texture for the main, grey parts. It probably looks great in EV though, since detail is mostly lost in spin views unless the ship is huge.
**Are you trying to mock me, really? Well I ain't exactly quaking either. Now Onxy (pardon me if I spelled it wrong) could probably beat both of us, but we're not talking about that right now. And of course no offense to you, but although the pulse-fighter may have some nice after effects, the ship, pardon my french, looks like a flying astro-turd. The design underneath is very simple, but you try to in essence put make-up all over it so it looks moderatly good. Small details may help, but they aren't going to save a poor design. Same goes with the second, the ships are a realatively simple design but ytou put loads of "make-up" on them to make them appear complex. You even showed how ridiculously complex you make them, over a hundred objects for one cargo pod. Now your third one, although not all that original, is a lot better.
You're getting me pissed off, and I wouldn't say un-intentionally. Seems to me you're were trying to make me think I was worthless. Well hey, there's nothing wrong with fair-play then is there?
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-Shade(url="http://"http://www.crosswinds.net/~shadeofblue/")EV:O Revenge(/url)
"Science is like sex: sometimes something useful comes out, but that is not the reason we are doing it"
(url="http://"http://www.theonion.com")The Onion(/url)
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And of course no offense to you, but although the pulse-fighter may have some nice after effects, the ship, pardon my french, looks like a flying astro-turd.
Lol
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"Landing request denied."- The Igadzra
Company Tritanium Enterprises: (url="http://"http://www.megalink.net/~joe1/w/")http://www.megalink.net/~joe1/w/(/url)
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ShadeOfBlue wrote:
Oh that's right, I forgot; staight lines are supposed to end in a graceful loop de loop. What was I thinking? You might also want to notice that is is also a bump map, and considering how picky you were, that should've been easy to notice. And about the second part: it should plainly be banned from the competition. Although true, you did make the model, textures are a big thing. You seem to be happy to say, "I downloaded somebodie elses free textures from so my ship looks great!" so would you be happy to say, "I downloaded somebodies elses free ship model and gave it a new paint job so now it looks great!"Y'know, you're right, it IS a bump map. A really slight one, and it's also a texture map. I'm just trying to give you some advice: I learned a while ago dark lines on a ship aren't that attractive. About the lines ending, I never said anything about loopdeloops, but if you're trying to simulate plating they should end against each other. If you're not, I'm sorry.
About using Onyx's textures, I never mentioned the contest. I was simply making a suggestion, use resources that are out there. I wouldn't submit a ship from a free graphics shipyard to the contest either, but they're available for use. When they're worthy, use them. That's what they're there for.
BTW I AM using my own textures for my graphics for the contest.
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ShadeOfBlue wrote:
Are you trying to mock me, really? Well I ain't exactly quaking either. Now Onxy (pardon me if I spelled it wrong) could probably beat both of us, but we're not talking about that right now. And of course no offense to you, but although the pulse-fighter may have some nice after effects, the ship, pardon my french, looks like a flying astro-turd. The design underneath is very simple, but you try to in essence put make-up all over it so it looks moderatly good. Small details may help, but they aren't going to save a poor design. Same goes with the second, the ships are a realatively simple design but ytou put loads of "make-up" on them to make them appear complex. You even showed how ridiculously complex you make them, over a hundred objects for one cargo pod. Now your third one, although not all that original, is a lot better.sigh This argument is getting ridiculously long.
No, I'm not trying to mock you. I wasn't trying to mock you at, what was it? 1:30 in the morning while I was working on a chemistry project? (yes that's my excuse, take it if you want) Yes, I admit the pulsefighter is of poor design. A moderate cockpit stuck onto a stretched cube, with pretty nifty wings, borrowed engines, and some guns I just made, all with useless details. The main effect was the whole image, not just the fighter, and as you said that's nice. And yes, small details won't save poor design, but anything with a flat grey texture and no details, no matter how good the design, looks equally bad. (Unless you want something smooth and metal, but that's another story. That only works for aliens or civilian ships.)
On the second one, also, yes the cruiser was just made to stick in there. The design was based on a scantron test I'd had in Chem, an idea I'd had. With work it could be cool. The fighter, on the other hand, is like the third. But again, the effect was for the whole image, not just the ships individually.
And, the 100 objects or whatever was just for this one ship for this competition, and if I may say so it looks COOL right now.
And, about the third, that more accurately represents what I do now. Those are the first of my current endeavour, of style and detail. The pulsefighter didn't turn out even remotely shaped like I'd intended. The fighters in the battle scene was the ship made in the set of the third, but before I got inspired. BTW, how do you mean, unoriginal? If you mean to each other, they shouldn't be, they're in the same set. If not, what do you mean?
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ShadeOfBlue wrote:
You're getting me pissed off, and I wouldn't say un-intentionally. Seems to me you're were trying to make me think I was worthless. Well hey, there's nothing wrong with fair-play then is there?It was un-intentional. There's nothing you can do or say to make me feel worthless "back", even if you make some ultra-realistic movie-grade ship. I'd take it as a challenge and a goal, to better myself to that level. That was my mindset when I was just starting ships, when I was at your level, even where I am now. I've seen ships on the internet that would crush mine instantly. (go to (url="http://"http://www.community3d.com)")http://www.community3d.com)(/url) The only thing I see "better" about me is time, and then it's an advantage, not a quality. I see no reason that, with time, you wouldn't get better, but we can't speed up time. I don't hold it against you, and you should see it as a fact, not an insult, and strive to lessen the gap as I have been.
And, if you intend to make me feel worthless with words, good luck. It won't work.
I don't mean to insult you. I don't mean to make you feel worthless. Depending on how long you've been shipmaking and how much effort you've been putting into it, you could be right on par, super-fantastic, or no good whatsoever, but I don't know. I'd say I'm ahead of the game, but then again graphics are my life. I never looked up to Matt Dailey, AJ, or Onyx and thought "oh, they're so good and I'm so bad, I'd better be miserable and quit", I thought I should strive to improve if it's really that important to me. So c'mon, stop feeling miserable and insulted, feel ready to make your best shot. Who cares if you even come in last in the contest? (to your insulted side: I'm not saying you will) As long as you give it your best shot and plan to improve, that's what matters.
end of sermon
---------------Now, to be helpful. How do I improve, you might ask? Well, here's my mini-guide.
1. Don't slack off. I was emailing Kyle Moeller about his graphics when he became so good, and got valueable texturing info. I was emailing fatalin.tycho (darn it, I keep calling him that instead of Onyx!) about his thought processes on details. I kept seeing his realistic, detail-filled ships and wondering how he invented it all. That has always been my weak part. He responded, maybe not as helpfully as I'd hoped for, but you can't really email thoughts in retrospet. Nonetheless, it helped me. And, whatever you do, don't give up. It's a task, not something that happens automatically.Oh, BTW, Shade, how old are you? I think I've seen that as I've gotten older it's helped me, not just time passing. I'm 15.
2. Imitatate. Find someone's graphics who you think are great, and try to imitate theirs. Even try to reproduce it if you want (don't use it for anything though :)). For example, though my set (the 3rd graphic) doesn't look exactly like Onyx's valkyrie, it was inspired by it and borrowed heavily from it. It uses his textures. It has some elements almost taken directly from it (especially the destroyer). The pipes and such connect to parts inspired directly from it. I thought his valkyrie was so neat I was going to make my next ship close to it, and it worked. Now I'm further away from it, but the knowledge and experience I gained from making it helped me.
Part 2 on imitate: I did and do use his textures. There's nothing wrong with that, since they're available, but it's not original. However, it's a great filler until I learn how to make good textures, and I can look at it and see how it's composed. I can make something similar, see how it's composed, learn from that, and go make my own. I just haven't had the time yet.
Also, it was good experience on how to apply textures, and it would be for you too.
3. Experiment. How do you think I made the shields in my battle scene? How do you think I made the pulses on the pulsefighter? Why do you think I made the pulsefighter at all, or if you saw it, my "yow" fighter? I was experimenting. Sometimes it's great, sometimes it's a flop, but either way you learn. I loved seeing these large images of complex ships, of Onyx's and AJ's, so I tried making one. The result was the soon-edited "yow" fighter. Designing a ship for a large image helps you to put in detail, since in the large image you see where it's lacking. I learned more from making my scenes or large images than from anything else I made.
4. Keep an open mind. Accept tips others may give you, or if you ask for help don't dismiss what you get. Don't be insulted if someone says you ship needs more detail, or even if they say "you suck get off this board". That's the time to contact the admins, ban that person, and then accept it as constructive criticizm. Yes, "it's bad" doesn't say much. That's why you see #1 and ask them, what's bad? How can it be improved?
I hope this small guide will help you. I love to improve graphically, and I love to see good graphics. I'd love to see you improve. Competition is good, goals are good. In the world of graphics, unless you've tried for 3 years and can't get any better, everything is good.
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I hope this whole post has cleared things up and will help you. The best way you could get back at me is to, sometime in the future, beat me in the graphics contest. Well, maybe not, since I won't take it as something bad, but as another challenge and goal. But it'd sure be satisfying for you, right?
No hard feelings, ok?
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Yikes that was long! Do take the time to read it, Shade. (I'm just saying this since you might not, since it's like an essay or something... :eek: )
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(This message has been edited by Weepul 884 (edited 02-25-2000).)
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Sorry, I was kinda of being an ass I guess. Had other things on my mind and got pissed of. Hope no hurt feelings.
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-Shade(url="http://"http://www.crosswinds.net/~shadeofblue/")EV:O Revenge(/url)
"Science is like sex: sometimes something useful comes out, but that is not the reason we are doing it"
(url="http://"http://www.theonion.com")The Onion(/url)
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Umm. What should I say, Hi?
Anyway, I have a few questions.
I've read you say about programs for making ships and other stuff. So far the only things I have are worl scenery scince I dont know of the programs you use for making your ships. Infinity-D or whatever, I tried looking for it on the web and I end up in music pages or adult. I know, you are laughing your heads off. Truth is Im new at web surfing and get lost prety easly.
Now. I make graphics using Draw 8, Photo-Paint 8, and for 3-d and mecha stuff I use Vector Works, finaly for quick scenery I use Bryce 4. The result is most of the time a stuning graphic, but usually takes time, to much to be true.
I could probably come up with something fast, but due to the nature of the programs it is time comsuming and the files end up too large. So what do you say, got any expert advise for a "newbee" to the "afficionado graphic club"?
By the way, I dont know how to make sprites, tried but ended frustrated. By the talk, the programs you mention allow or are specially useful for this kind of task.
Gracias
Arturo a.k.a. Mindwalker
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"To be is to be in the future. To be is to choose hope, faith in life"
-Peter Koestenbaum, Philosopher and Humanist, my friend.------------------
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Mindwalker wrote:
I've read you say about programs for making ships and other stuff. So far the only things I have are worl scenery scince I dont know of the programs you use for making your ships. Infinity-D or whatever, I tried looking for it on the web and I end up in music pages or adult. I know, you are laughing your heads off. Truth is Im new at web surfing and get lost prety easly.Well, it's Infini-D, and it's made by MetaCreations (http://www.metacreations.com) but I'm pretty sure they're discontinuing it or already have, and merged Infini-D with RayDream to form the currently awful Carrara.
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Now. I make graphics using Draw 8, Photo-Paint 8, and for 3-d and mecha stuff I use Vector Works, finaly for quick scenery I use Bryce 4. The result is most of the time a stuning graphic, but usually takes time, to much to be true.
I'd be interested to see what you've made, since you say it's "stunning". For this competition, "stunning" is the name of the game.
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I could probably come up with something fast, but due to the nature of the programs it is time comsuming and the files end up too large. So what do you say, got any expert advise for a "newbee" to the "afficionado graphic club"?
By fast, what do you mean? I've been working on 1 ship since the start of the contest, so it's not going fast at all. As long as it can be made before the contest ends and looks good, that's all that is needed.
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By the way, I dont know how to make sprites, tried but ended frustrated. By the talk, the programs you mention allow or are specially useful for this kind of task.
Yes, they are. RayDream, Carrara, Infini-D, and Bryce all support animation so it's little work to set up a top-view spin and render to PICS. If you can't render to PICS render to another animated format, or 36 picts and use the wonderful shareware GraphicConverter to convert it into a PICS file. Then use PICS2Sprites (downloadable somewhere on the EV site) to make it useable by EV. Each frame should be 10° rotated from the previous one, startig at vertical.
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By fast I mean 1 week for 256 color palete. First I hans draw, then scan, and start Painting over the drawing with Draw 8, I call it manual rendering. I'll e mail you one if I can get the blasted email courier to load my files.
See, me not good.
Oh, by the way, anyone know if someone is making graphics for a plug in based on Farscape?
I hand drew an altered Leviathan. Can I aply with that or does it have to be Computer Rendered? It actually would need a thousand color pallete for the drawing be transfered to CG. Tedious work, but worth it.
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I thought you meant 3D rendered. Hmm, hand rendered, interesting. Does it look realistically-3D?
Also, I'd heard talk of allowing drawn ships and such. I'm not the contest holder, so I can't say for sure what it's going to be. Email micah, or see if he replies.
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