I've created a "cheats" file category in both the EV and EVO file archive areas, at Chamrin's and Jude's suggestion. The rational is to weed the "chaff" of the proliferating cheat plugins from the rest of the game expanding/replacing plugins. Check out the new "cheats" category at:

EV: (url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/games/ev/addons.html")http://www.AmbrosiaS.../ev/addons.html(/url)
EVO: (url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/games/evo/addons.html")http://www.AmbrosiaS...evo/addons.html(/url)

I tried to move all of the obvious cheater plugs for each game into the "cheats" category, but I probably missed some -- hopefully the admins will assist me in getting all of these files in their proper place.

All of the files in the EVO archives seem to have good descriptions for them; we're still coming up rather short in the EV archives, so any help getting any files without descriptions named would be appreciated.

Similarly, if there are any duplicate files or files that are corrupted, please let us know so we can delete them.

I also made a few other minor tweaks to the display script to make the pages easier to read -- enjoy.

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Andrew Welch / el Presidente / Ambrosia Software, Inc.

Whoohoo! Satori Station's the 4th most downloaded plug again!

Also, could you make it possible to search the plugs by letters? Let's say you're searching for an obscure plug that starts with "T". On the OLD add-ons site, you would click on the "T". Now you have to search alphabetacly (sic) and try to guess on which of 12 pages it is.

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Quote

Originally posted by OctoberFost:
**Whoohoo! Satori Station's the 4th most downloaded plug again!

Also, could you make it possible to search the plugs by letters? Let's say you're searching for an obscure plug that starts with "T". On the OLD add-ons site, you would click on the "T". Now you have to search alphabetacly (sic) and try to guess on which of 12 pages it is.
**

That was my 1000th post! Yippe! On to 1100! I just might be able to pass up Andrew M. Not likey, though :frown:

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Ambrosia used to sort plug-ins by names a few months ago. Also, they used to have a page where you can view statistics for ships, wheapons, systems(I think), and missions. It was so good, but now it's gone. And I'm so mad, because that was so useful! AHHHHHHHHH!

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Jack Sullivan Cole
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Quote

Originally posted by jack_cole1989:
**Ambrosia used to sort plug-ins by names a few months ago. Also, they used to have a page where you can view statistics for ships, wheapons, systems(I think), and missions. It was so good, but now it's gone. And I'm so mad, because that was so useful! AHHHHHHHHH!
**

You can still view the plugins by name:

Go to the add ons page:

(url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/games/ev/addons.html")http://www.AmbrosiaS.../ev/addons.html(/url)

Under "Newest Plugins" click on "View More..."

In the resulting window, click on the "Name" tag at the top to sort them by name.

Ta da!

I agree the ship info pages were useful -- however there is a file in the guides section that provides all this and more, and you can easily print it out. Check under the guides section.

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Andrew Welch / el Presidente / Ambrosia Software, Inc.

As I've said before I do not understand what the problem is with "cheat" plug-ins. While I do like the idea of a separate category, I am dismayed to see that the number of downloads and the ratings have been lost for many of the plug-ins and that they are no longer listed in the most downloaded section. For many plug-in developers, "cheater" or otherwise, a measure of their success is seeing how many people download and enjoy the plug-in.
This is an unfair affront to designers of "cheat" plug-ins. The mention of a "proliferation" of "chaff" cheat plugs provides an insight into how Ambrosia feels about a section of its customer base. There are MANY non-cheat plug-ins which are difficult to use, filled with bugs, and offer little new to the players besides a recolored graphic or an outfit or two.
Why have "cheat" plugs been singled out?
Perhaps we should eliminate the "proliferation" of "chaff" non-cheater plugs which add "a new ship with one new weapon", or plugs which state "no missions yet but I may get around to them later." Perhaps, we should only allow plug-ins designed by professional programmers with access to hundreds of dollars of software, which meet Ambrosia's "high" standards, to upload to this site.
If this "chaff" is so offensive why does Ambrosia include several "cheat" plug-ins on its own CD? I would think "chaff" would be the last thing the company would want to send to its customers.
For me, the enjoyment gained from playing the game and tinkering with plug-in ideas is lost. I will no longer be purchasing Ambrosia software. There are far too many frustrations in life to subject one's self to this kind of treatment, when there are so many other forms of entertainment on which to spend one's hard earned wages.

Quote

Originally posted by SABER:
**As I've said before I do not understand what the problem is with "cheat" plug-ins. While I do like the idea of a separate category, I am dismayed to see that the number of downloads and the ratings have been lost for many of the plug-ins and that they are no longer listed in the most downloaded section. For many plug-in developers, "cheater" or otherwise, a measure of their success is seeing how many people download and enjoy the plug-in.
This is an unfair affront to designers of "cheat" plug-ins. The mention of a "proliferation" of "chaff" cheat plugs provides an insight into how Ambrosia feels about a section of its customer base. There are MANY non-cheat plug-ins which are difficult to use, filled with bugs, and offer little new to the players besides a recolored graphic or an outfit or two.
Why have "cheat" plugs been singled out?
**

Don't you think you're being a tad melodramatic? We (Ambrosia) don't particularly care one way or another how you get enjoyment out of the game -- many of the harcore EV fans, however, consider cheat plugins to be antithetical to the whole point of the game.

I think it makes complete sense to seperate "cheats" from plugins that extend or replace the game.

The ratings and download counts were lost due to a bug in the script -- as were the descriptions. I went in and manually re-entered all of the descriptions myself, I didn't notice that the DL count and ratings got nuked, too.

Not everything is a conspiracy; relax.

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Andrew Welch / el Presidente / Ambrosia Software, Inc.

SABER:
I don't think that andrew was meaning to be insulting in any way by using that analogy. I, too, argued that cheater plugs could be very useful, and it many cases were better plugs than the ones that only added a new graphic or something like that. And besides, people should be able to enjoy a solo game any way they want.
There were several people who were pushing to have all the cheater plugs deleted because they were tired of trying to find mission, system, and outfit plugs amidst all the cheater plugs. I think creating a separate category is a good idea. It helps people find what they are looking for a bit easier without getting rid of anything. It's too bad the download statistics were lost, though.
Jude

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andrew said:
We (Ambrosia) don't particularly care one way or another how you get enjoyment out of the game.

Wait do you mean that you don't care if we have fun or not or you don't car how we have fun? Because if you don't care if we enjoy ourselves then as far as i'm concerned you suck a much as bill gates. Profiteering. Can you speak on behalf of Matt Burch and Nathan Lamont and all of the designers? Or are you using the royal perogative? "We the presidemt of ambrosiasw..." If you do care then good on you.

P.S. I'll bet $10 that SABER was Bozorg/demegorgon. I'm gonna go check.

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"Are you SURE you cant fit any more rocket launchers on here?" Lothe Lan

"How can i make it go faster?" -my previous incarnation-

My apologies. Gives andre $10

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"Are you SURE you cant fit any more rocket launchers on here?" Lothe Lan

"How can i make it go faster?" -my previous incarnation-

Quote

Originally posted by Lothe Lan:
**
Wait do you mean that you don't care if we have fun or not or you don't car how we have fun? Because if you don't care if we enjoy ourselves then as far as i'm concerned you suck a much as bill gates. Profiteering. Can you speak on behalf of Matt Burch and Nathan Lamont and all of the designers? Or are you using the royal perogative? "We the presidemt of ambrosiasw..." If you do care then good on you.
**

sigh I meant that everyone enjoys playing EV/EVO in different ways, and none of them are "wrong" in our opinion.

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Andrew Welch / el Presidente / Ambrosia Software, Inc.

Well, I think if you are going to be adding things anyway you should include a most downloaded "other" section as well on your front page. It would be nice to see how things other than conventional plug-ins are doing. It also might be a good idea, since you are in the mood to make things easier, to separate the TC plugs and the larger plugs from the smaller plugs which only add a few things.
As for your customer service skills, well they leave a lot to be desired Andrew. Even if you think your customer is wrong it is never a good idea to mock them or to trivialize their complaints. While it might be fun to respond angrily or sarcastically it is also a really good way to lose a customer. In any business that is a real no no.

What the heck good is this cheat section when so many cheats still remain in the main category? At least two cheats are still on the most downloaded list.
I agree with Hawk, the big plug-ins (i.e. the good plug-ins) should be in a seperate area instead of the cheats. Just put the cheats in with all the other small plugs, and leave a special area for the largest plugs.

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Lie with passion and be forever damned

I don't think that's a good idea. "Small" is not the same term as "cheat".
If you want to see the big plugs, just sort them by size.

If there are still some cheat-plugs in the normal sections, I guess someone will be so cute to move them to the correct place. No big deal.

BTW, what's all this hype about "TC"? There are already several big plug-ins with excellent storyline/missions (and graphics) and which TC-plugs can I download right now (rhetorical question)?

- Marko

(This message has been edited by Marko (edited 06-20-2000).)

Quote

Originally posted by Secret Squirrel:
**What the heck good is this cheat section when so many cheats still remain in the main category? At least two cheats are still on the most downloaded list.
I agree with Hawk, the big plug-ins (i.e. the good plug-ins) should be in a seperate area instead of the cheats. Just put the cheats in with all the other small plugs, and leave a special area for the largest plugs.
**

I mentioned already that I needed help from you folks and from the admins to identify and move the cheats to the proper category. If you'd like to assist, please eMail me a list of the cheat plugins that are still in the main file area, so I can move them.

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Andrew Welch / el Presidente / Ambrosia Software, Inc.

Well, EVenabler101 and Millioncreditmission are both cheats that still remain on the most downloaded list.
By the way, what constitutes a cheater? If you add a bunch of NEW but powerful ships are you not a cheater? What about a small plug-in that adds an overly powerful ship after a few missions? If all the graphics are new is it a cheater? If it just gives players access to all the ships at regular prices is it a cheater? I'm confused, cause it seems kinda arbitrary.
And, as others have already mentioned, how about a most downloaded list that reflects all the categories, so we can see what people like the most. If that is not feasible, then how about a most downloaded list for each section. There would seem to be plenty of room on the main add-ons page for such an addition. I'm not trying to nag, but it is true that the most downloaded plug-ins for both EV and EVO before the new category were cheats. While some hardcore players may hate them it is obvious that a lot of others like the things.
How does everyone else feel? And please, no "cheaters suck" comments.

Quote

Originally posted by Secret Squirrel:
**What the heck good is this cheat section when so many cheats still remain in the main category? At least two cheats are still on the most downloaded list.
**

And why is this a problem? The reason for having a 'most downloaded' list is to show what's hot in the world of plugs. If you're going to edit the list in the name of other criteria (like dislike of cheats), why bother to have a list at all? Most folks should be satisfied by Andrew's creation of a separate cheat category. The cheats are still available, and their separation from more straightforward plugs should help calm the easily offended (those who just cannot stand having to look at names like 'Gazillion Credit Mission' or 'Galaxy Class Shuttle').

And as to separating large plugs from small—again, why? It is easy enough to sort the plugs by size, if you really need to do that.

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PlanetPhil
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