Well, I'm into my game and doing well so I thought I'd see what happens when I built a release. I've done absolutely nothing out of the ordinary. That is, I've not tried to use the engine any way that it wasn't designed to do according to the manual. Also, I habitually try EVERYTHING I build into the game to see that it works correctly via the launch button.

I built it only for Mac (not OX)

No sound.
No music.

It asked for my registration code, and said that the game was built with an unregistered Coldstone engine. I never did download the demo. I paid for it and waited until I got the CD and loaded the CD. I put in my code before I did anything.

It did quite well, except for sound and music, until into the game. My Player tried to pick up something and it crashed.

I'm not an alarmist. I'm no longer creating my game in Coldstone. I'll wait for when they get the bugs out. Or I find an engine for Mac that works. Meantime, I'll work on graphics. If they DO get the bugs out, I expect to NOT pay extra for it.

------------------
-- Debra
Danillitphil Productions

Did you stop and think that your problems may be operator error? With a little more information, and a lot of teamwork, we can work through these problems. If they are truly bugs, we can contact Glenn, and get them on the master list. Then you'll have something to complain about, until then give us details

------------------
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To say, "then you'll have something to complain about" is unwarranted. Like I said, I tried, without exception, everything that I built when I built it. This is not operator error.

It seems to me that everyone who has "released" their game has had similar, if not exactly the same, problems. People who build seem to have the problems while people who make plug-ins do not.

Something else I've noticed -- if you post a "Coldstone doesn't work right" topic on this board, you pay a price.

I'm not angry at the Coldstone developers. I'm aware just how difficult it is to make such an application program. There's been a similar trend by those of us who have built a game from scratch. The people who released the application program need to know about this trend, and I think that posting this is appropriate. I expect that the developers will address it. I am, indeed, trying to help by posting this. Meanwhile, I intend to work on graphics.

I have not, nor will I, flame or debase anybody. Please don't indicate that I'm stupid. Thanks.

------------------
-- Debra
Danillitphil Productions

I guess i'm just lucky then, i have never encountered this sound error, i have made 7preliminary builds today the seventh and final one today features a 30second track which loads when the game starts(company music...kinda like SEGA).
The preliminary level features 3 ambient sounds a cricket, ocean wave and wind
music- mp3
sound- aiff ,system 7 sounds

What format is your music and sounds could this be the problem with your game? Although CGE utilizes quicktime technology it is not an equivalent...

------------------

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Quote

Originally posted by Debra:
**
<snip>
**

But you are over-reacting. dampeoples simply asked for more information, and you treat it like an assault on your intelligence.

Furthermore, not everyone has had this problem with compiling. It's just that those who haven't aren't posting that it worked.

To start off with, here are some 'feeder' questions:

Have you attempted to build the game before this?
Are you using weird file formats?
Are all of the proper files in the game folder after you've built it?

------------------
Is if evil? Well then, it is evil and yet I do it. - The Crucible, Arthur Miller.

Quote

Originally posted by Debra:
**To say, "then you'll have something to complain about" is unwarranted. Like I said, I tried, without exception, everything that I built when I built it. This is not operator error.

I assume you tried these things individually?

It seems to me that everyone who has "released" their game has had similar, if not exactly the same, problems. People who build seem to have the problems while people who make plug-ins do not.

There are like three games that are 'released' built from Coldstone, not including PoG.

Something else I've noticed -- if you post a "Coldstone doesn't work right" topic on this board, you pay a price.

Depends, if you make a general statement like 'Yep, Coldstone doesn't work' on an enthusiasts board, you just might.

I'm not angry at the Coldstone developers. I'm aware just how difficult it is to make such an application program. There's been a similar trend by those of us who have built a game from scratch. The people who released the application program need to know about this trend, and I think that posting this is appropriate. I expect that the developers will address it. I am, indeed, trying to help by posting this. Meanwhile, I intend to work on graphics.

I'm sure the developers, as well as the users appreciate it, but a little more in-depth information is all that I asked for.

I have not, nor will I, flame or debase anybody. Please don't indicate that I'm stupid. Thanks.

Could you point me to where I indicated you were stupid? I asked if you ever thought the problem was yours, instead of blaming the engine.

**

------------------
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Here are a few more questions:
What version of Coldstone do you have?
What OS are you running?
What computer are you using?
How much (non virtual) RAM do you have?

Try compiling with build and release instead of build and launch. Build and launch has been having bad results occasionally. Also, check the uncompiled folder. Make sure all files there are the right types, and that they are all supported Coldstone.

That should do for now. Keep us up to date.

------------------
CI-I@()s

Quote

cgoran:
**I get no sound when I publish.
I get a windows build that will not execute at all.
I get a unqualified regestration prompt
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dee: **
Yes, this is all side effects of the same bug: the compilation comes to an unexpected halt which prevents the copy of any additional media (sounds, movies, music), prevents the registration process to complete, and finally, prevents the copy of a file needed under Windows.

and

Quote

**
- This is definitely a weird bug. It may be caused by RB or maybe it's something within the code of Coldstone that is messing up RB. To put it simple, it reaches the end of a function but doesn't seem to return to the previous function on the stack. Actually, it goes into an infinite loop but since it's in a thread executing in the background, it doesn't freeze the app. Again, there's nothing to conclude from this, just that I'm investigating the problem.
- I would be suprised if it would be directly related to file size (single or multiple). Number of files? Perhaps. However, as David mentioned, PoG was compiled with Coldstone and has probably more files than any of your game.

So, you can't just state that Coldstone won't build any working game. That is simply not true. I haven't isolated the problem yet but it's not a general issue for sure. As soon as I can find what cause this, I should, at least, be able to post a workaround.**

A solution is forthcoming. Please be patient.

-Andiyar

------------------
"Any good that I may do here, let me do now, for I may not pass this way again"

(This message has been edited by Tarnćlion Andiyarus (edited 11-24-2002).)

I'm working on a Mac Powerbook G3
8.6
Lots o' ram and disk space

I loaded in the Medieval game and then did the "Build Release" (Mac Classic). I quit Coldstone and ran the Medieval Game. Didn't get the not-properly-registered window. And I got sound and music. I didn't play the game. Just in and out. So I don't know if it will crash. I'll see about that tomorrow.

So I looked at the differences.

I found a .DS_Store in my pictures folder that wasn't in the Medieval game. I didn't put it there. I pulled it out. I also didn't have a TOOLS folder. I copied it over from the Medieval game. I pulled out everthing from my folders that I wasn't using. (I'm not finished with my game, so had them in there.)

I trashed the old release and hit "Build Release". Quit Coldstone and played it. I didn't get the not-properly-registered window. And I got sound and music.

After a while, it crashed.

I built this three times and got the same thing.

I've been having difficulty with the NPC files. The right-most tab. Under "Player contact" link. For the passive NPCs, I usually have a dialogue there. When I try it, my Player sometimes has to butt up against the NPC or I use the "x" key, or I click on the character. But the problem is is that I have to do this several times before the dialogue will open. The same thing happened when I built the game.

I have 3 times the number of events, 2 times the sound, and over 2 times the items than the Medieval game. I have one map (so far). I'm not writing about POG, you know, but the Medieval Game that comes with the application program.

I'm aware of the challenge of creating an application program like this. I didn't attack anybody. I am being patient. The build doesn't work properly. The developers obviously know this. But to say that it does isn't entirely true.

Hope this helps.

------------------
-- Debra
Danillitphil Productions

I only have one suggestion, which I am doing as well:

Send Stark the folder to debug it.

------------------
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Quote

Originally posted by PinkFluffyBunny:
**I only have one suggestion, which I am doing as well:

Send Stark the folder to debug it.

**

PB i Have one suggestion for you might take you far in life:

Dont volanteer for others, Stark has a real life somewhere and if he was kind enough to take the time to debug your game dosent mean hed like to see every game that comes domn the pike.

Quote

Originally posted by Debra:
It seems to me that everyone who has "released" their game has had similar, if not exactly the same, problems. People who build seem to have the problems while people who make plug-ins do not.

"everyone" does not have this problem I've built releases of a full game that was 7mb when done and not had this issue. The game played fine it used Original graphics and crash only in spots where I laged and forgot to complete scripting. (i always want to add just one more feature then blam I brake it)

So when you ALL have this problem me and the few other who have working projects can only wonder what the heck is going on. That why we assume user error cuz 9 outa 10 times thats what it was for us.

pls see my post here for what a .DS_Store file is/does:
(url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/webboard/Forum48/HTML/001577.html")http://www.AmbrosiaS...TML/001577.html(/url)

namaste
~stray

------------------
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(This message has been edited by straytoaster (edited 11-24-2002).)

It is not spin.

quote:
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by cgoran:
I get no sound when I publish.
I get a windows build that will not execute at all.
I get a unqualified regestration prompt
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Yes, this is all side effects of the same bug: the compilation comes to an unexpected halt which prevents the copy of any additional media (sounds, movies, music), prevents the registration process to complete, and finally, prevents the copy of a file needed under Windows.

------------------
Dee Brown
Beenox inc. - (url="http://"http://www.beenox.com")www.beenox.com(/url)
Coldstone Game Engine / Pillars of Garendall developers

------------------

I only encounter the failure to build error whnen trying to nest my game inside of the medievaal game, which as you know is 27mb when i finished it had ballooned up to 55.1mb and at this point it would not build....luckily i have actually pinPointed the type of error that you and others are experiencing... StackOverFlowException , it is exactly how it sounds RB whiich handles the compiling is not prepared to handle a large amount of files, simply ist is limited...this type of error abounds everywhere in the architeccture of RB, for instance attempt if you can to open a folder consisting of 10 or more png graphics at some point you will overload the editor...there is little wrong with the actual app, its just too much for RB to handle.

Perhaps coldstone should be split into an environment and a simple console drag and drop compiler ( that presents you with a simple build dialog )?

------------------

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Well, the bottom line for me is that I didn't do anything out of the ordinary with Coldstone. I'm wondering if anyone other than beta testers has successfully built a game? It seems to me that beta testers or some people on this board have some kind of knowledge about how to see the code (like "aliases") while they're building. I certainly don't know how Ellrx can see what he seems to see to pronounce a solution, albeit unreadable. I admit that his "solution" post has finally made me angry. And I admit that it's my choice to be angry.

All I know to do is to use the application program. And yet it didn't build properly. To say that Coldstone builds games is true -- but not true for everyone. It doesn't seem to be true for people like me, who has no real knowledge about Real Basic. Who simply expects an application program to work. If I weren't reading this board and instead simply bought and used the application program that wouldn't build, given the advertisement and the manual, I'd say there was misrepresentation going on. I certainly haven't had any contact with anyone other than people who choose to read this board.

Perhaps it's time for me to learn Visual C++. Yes, I know that Coldstone is made with Real Basic.

------------------
-- Debra
Danillitphil Productions

Quote

Originally posted by Debra:
~snip~

Debra,

Don't worry, we believe that you are having these crashing problems, and we certainly realize you are frustrated(I would be if I were encountering this). I'm sorry you are having problems but hopefully they are fixable either by you or by Beenox figuring something out.

I read Ellrx's alias posting and, while I agree that it was a quick and excited post that was difficult to read, there may be something to it. But we can go through it if the circumstances fit yours.

So first, and I apologize if you've mentioned it previously and I do not remember, but what OS are you operating under? And if you are using OS X, have you ever switched between OS X and classic mode with your coldstone creation?

Thanks, and again I'm sorry you're frustrated. Hopefully we can figure something out for you.

------------------
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Yes, I have mentioned it before, but I'm happy to mention it again.

I'm using a Powerbook G3
OS 8.6
Build/Released in Classic mode
I made it in Classic Coldstone (as you can guess from my OS)

It just seems to me that we ARE the beta testers here. At least it doesn't seem as if this product was really tested by people like me. One with a "lot of imagination". A person who does not know how to access the code but am very competent with computers.

Oh, I'm not angry with Ellrx. His writing hides his intelligence. I'm angry because some people seem to be able to see something that the stand-alone application does not allow others to see. And it's those people who have "solutions". The problem with that is that I don't know how to solve my own problems because I don't have the tools to do so. That includes, unfortunately, an incomplete manual.

I write web pages with Dreamweaver. I know HTML, and that application allows me to see the code. I also use CGI scripts, which I DON'T know. But the CGI scripts are stand-alone products and they work. I suspect that allowing the general public to see the Real Basic code is not practical, any more than it's practical to have the public mess around with CGI scripting. But if that's the case, then the developers need to test the product by the poor schmucks like me who are forced to use it as a stand-alone product.

------------------
-- Debra
Danillitphil Productions

Quote

Originally posted by Debra:
I'm using a Powerbook G3
OS 8.6
Build/Released in Classic mode
I made it in Classic Coldstone (as you can guess from my OS)

Yeah, I just re-read the thread in its entirety and noticed you did state this earlier. My apology for not reading more carefully. I dislike repeating myself(as opposed to elaborating which I don't mind at all), and shouldn't require others to repeat themselves. Sorry.

Quote

It just seems to me that we ARE the beta testers here. At least it doesn't seem as if this product was really tested by people like me. One with a "lot of imagination". A person who does not know how to access the code but am very competent with computers.

Possibly, possibly not. The problem with a game builder, as opposed to a game, is that the developers really don't know what you are going to think of to create. Since there are so many possibilities it is very difficult to bug test. Realize this isn't a cop-out nor a justification, just a FYI.

Quote

Oh, I'm not angry with Ellrx. His writing hides his intelligence.

Hahaha. I'll agree with that fully.

On a serious note, unless I completely missed something in Ellrx's post, which is quite possible, since you are not using the X version of Coldstone then his solutions are not applicable to you. Unfortunately something else needs to be found for you...

Darn it.

------------------
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Okay, well, I've posted above what's REALLY bugging me (get it?) so I need to not be angry anymore -- for a while.

I'm assuming that the developers are, indeed, addressing these problems and WILL release a fix. Right?

------------------
-- Debra
Danillitphil Productions

Quote

Originally posted by Debra:
**Okay, well, I've posted above what's REALLY bugging me (get it?) so I need to not be angry anymore -- for a while.

I'm assuming that the developers are, indeed, addressing these problems and WILL release a fix. Right?**

Dee has told us that there will be a 1.0.2 update. The developers I'm sure are well aware of these problems, so it is my hope as well that they are looked into and fixed when the update becomes available.

And hopefully that occurs sooner rather than later.

------------------
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Quote

Originally posted by Debra:
It just seems to me that we ARE the beta testers here. At least it doesn't seem as if this product was really tested by people like me. One with a "lot of imagination". A person who does not know how to access the code but am very competent with computers.

I'd like to second Stark's response to this, but also add a note or two of my own.

First off, know that I, as a beta tester, am likewise extremely unthrilled with the number of bugs that have been popping up. They make us look bad, and I like to think that I put a lot of effort into hunting down and finding out bugs. I'd blame the other testers for not pulling their own weight, but that wouldn't be nice. Rest assured that as soon as we get our hands on a beta of 1.0.2 (which, sadly, hasn't happened yet) we will do our best to test the living *%&$ out of it for you.

Second, while it doesn't excuse or explain the other miscellaneous bugs, this particular bug, at least, could reasonably be explained by the fact that building a release is something that, frankly, doesn't tend to occur until fairly late in the development process. I know that I, for one, simply never even tried building a release during the beta just because I never had a project that was nearly that far in development, and there were plenty of things to debug much earlier in the game development process.

------------------
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