I found your comment, Mackilroy , that "we can't let the terrorists get a free kill" (when you had accepted that you were going to be killed, a touch preemptively) to be quite suspicious. The thing is, an innocent dying is in no way helping the innocents. The purpose of not letting the terrorists get a free kill is the CHANCE that the person the innocents selected was a terrorist-- but after that random (mostly random anyway) selection has settled on an innocent, it no longer becomes useful for that person to die. Giving the terrorists a free kill would be beneficial compared to killing an innocent. The sentiment that we have to make a kill each round in order to find the terrorists, and if it's you, so be it, you'll die for the cause, is counterproductive. We must always remember that the task at hand is to eliminate the terrorists, and people saying stuff that is essentially "I'll die happily knowing the terrorists didn't get a free kill..." when all that's happening is that they are dying, as an innocent, just shows that many players are getting caught up in traditions or ideals of the game (such as killing of SIB obnoxiously often or feeling obligated to make a kill even if you're 99% sure that kill is of an innocent) and not what we're actually playing for.

Another thought: Eugene Chin voted for SIB, Mackilroy, and then Rebellious. Then he was killed. Reading into wolf kills, especially this early in the game, is absurd, but possibly later in the game we might begin to see a pattern of who the wolf's victim voted for before they died, so it might be good to keep a log of the victim's voting record after they die.

This post has been edited by jrsh92 : 20 August 2008 - 11:34 AM

I agree that Mackilroy looks somewhat suspicious. I was going to vote for him before now, but I decided to wait and see whether there might not be a better target first. I didn't find one, needless to say ;).

At the time, jrsh, it was 5 in my favor, 3 against. Those odds don't look good, neh? I wasn't even home when the votes began changing.

As for a free kill, I should clarify - a free extra kill. They automatically get one every round, but it's not in our best interest to give them another one.

Also, this is the second time you've bandwagoned against me, jrsh. Why don't you take a stand of your own instead of following someone else's lead? Why not? Because you know if you pick someone yourself you'll be revealed as a terrorist.

And since you all so freely judge me without apparently considering anyone else, I'll give you some additional points to consider. If, as a terrorist, there was a vote for me and a vote for someone else, why wouldn't it make sense for me to vote for that person (Shlimazel) instead of sticking to my guns and keeping my vote for jrsh? Because I don't want them to get that extra free kill. If we guess right, we get one and that gives us better chances against how ever many terrorists remain. Do I want to die? Not at all, despite what jrsh might lead you to believe.

Current Votes

Mackilroy
RJC Ultra
orcaloverbri9
jrsh92
Shlimazel

jrsh92
Mackilroy

Shlimazel
Templar98921

No Vote
SoItBegins

Killing an innocent is not "preventing them from getting a free kill"! Any innocent player should realize that their death will not help the innocents at all. If you are innocent, and know that you are innocent, while everyone else might want to "make sure they get a guess at who the terrorists are" and "not give the terrorists a free kill" by picking you to die, YOU should recognize that BECAUSE it was YOU chosen to die, that will not help the innocents. It's a simple matter of probability.

There were 9 players when this game started. Let's assume that 2 of these players are terrorists. The first round of voting, voting for a random player gives a 2/9 chance of killing a terrorist, a little better than 1 in 5. However, at the end of the first round there is a 100% chance that an innocent will die. The purpose of the random voting is to try to eliminate a terrorist, obviously, and you don't want to have no kill giving a 0% chance of a terrorist death and then to allow a nightkill, giving a 0% terrorist death rate and then a 100% innocent death rate.
However, say for this example that I have been picked the first round, and I am innocent. On one hand, the vote among people who essentially knew nothing and were guessing had a 2/9 chance of selecting a terrorist. But they selected an innocent. As the only innocent at that point who knows that I am innocent, I am the only person who realizes that killing me has NO chance of killing a terrorist. It might help the terrorists to fight against a random kill happening because random is in favor of killing one of them compared to no kill at all. HOWEVER, fighting against the death of an innocent including yourself is NOT helping the terrorists. Allowing an innocent to die WILL help the terrorists. What people like Mackilroy aren't realizing is that the point of not giving the terrorists a free kill in this case would be to have a 2/9 chance of killing a terrorist. Once that probability has proved to be negative, once that event has been revealed as "not going to happen", the usefulness of killing someone in the first round is absolutely GONE. Killing an innocent or allowing yourself, as an innocent, to die, is not "keeping the terrorists from getting a free kill". It's GIVING them another free kill.

Mack, I'm not sure if you're a terrorist or just a touch disconnected from reality. Either way, my vote stays on you for now.

jrsh, you and I are arguing the same thing. I'm agreeing with you here. Yes, killing an innocent does not prevent them from getting a free kill. Where have I said otherwise? I'm hardly disconnected from reality. Based on your overmisinterpretation of my post it would be you who is a touch disconnected from reality. You've got this bizarre idea that I'm disagreeing with you, that I believe that allowing innocents to die does not help the terrorists. I believe the exact opposite, which is why I didn't change my vote from someone who's been acting suspicious (you) to someone who, if I were a terrorist, would probably die easily since they would've had the most votes at that time, and perhaps still now. I'm voting based on logical interpretations of other people's writing and voting, while you're badly misinterpreting my posts and voting for me because you knew I'd be an easy mark after someone else opened the bandwagon for you. Your actions scream 'terrorist' to me. What better way to disguise yourself than to shift all of your behavior onto me?

You've also skipped the fact that ties also result in deaths of innocents with no terrorist losses. Why? Because you know to point that out will jeopardize your chances for a terrorist victory?

So if my math is right, the round will be ending tonight, which would put the end of round in about 2 hours. If you want to change your vote, you got until then to do it. Also I'd like to get PMs from people that need to PM me.

Round Two Votes
jrsh92 - Mackilroy
Mackilroy - jrsh92
orcaloverbri9 - Mackilroy
RJC Ultra - Mackilroy
SoItBegins -
Shlimazel - Mackilroy
Templar98921 - Shlimazel

_"Well my pretty little people, I see we've decided on who to kill. Who is it, Mr. Fishie? What? We're killing Shlimazel?" mrxak asks.

"What! No! We're killing Mackilroy!" Shlimazel protests. "Mr. Fishie always lies!"

"Oh yes, of course, I should've asked Mr. Doggy. I see," mrxak listened carefully to the balloon animal. "Yes, you're quite right. We're going to kill Mackilroy. Take him away guards!"

Mackilroy is dragged away kicking and screaming. mrxak laughs from the podium.

"And guards, go to high alert. We may be haqre nugginpox ol gur erzenvavat angovbaf. Pesky bastards. I knew we should've kept better security," mrxak called to them. "Now my minions, feast! Feast upon your delicious snacks at the vending machine!"

The delegates look around at each other and then shuffle towards the vending machine, but as they approach each offers to let the others go first.

"Oh, don't worry, Speedy tells me he fixed that spike pit trap door personally. There shouldn't be any danger," mrxak says. The delegates appear to be nervous still, but go and get their snacks. On the way back to their seats, RJC Ultra lags behind. He begins to cough, then falls to the ground.

"Hey! You okay?" jrsh92 bends over him.

"I... should've... used... exact... change," RJC Ultra says, then promptly dies. A single quarter rolls out of his hand, and one of the delegates bends down to pick it up.

"Don't touch that!" mrxak shouts. "The coin is poison! Ugh, headache."

mrxak walks up the small ramp from the speed boat and steps onto the submarine. He looks around at the half dozen nameless henchmen.

"Zel tabbiq naq unccul sevraqf. Vo fognaq orsber libh ba gur savryq bis gur yenfog ternog onggyr bis guvf jabeyq. Jor funyy quvir fobba, bapr Vo naz vafavqor gur fhoznevar, naq libh funyy sovtug gib gur qorngu gib farr jub jivyy zonxr vag vagb gur nave yabpx. Bayl bar bs libh zonl yavir, ohg jubrire qobrof funyy or ivprebel sabe gur qonl," mrxak says, then steps into the airlock. On the bridge, he gives additional orders. "Yanhapu noyy erzanvavat ahxorf, naq ortva faceranqvat gur ovbjirnocba. Ugh, who's turn is it for volleyball?"

"Volleyball?" orcaloverbri9 asked.

"Yes, volleyball, dangit," mrxak appears frustrated. "I didn't build this volleyball court in my secret underwater base for nothing!"

"Secret underwater base?" SoItBegins asks, confused.

"Yes, no, I mean, beach volleyball. Yes, we need to go to the beach! Everyone to the cars! We'll continue voting and killing people there!" mrxak yells, picking up his balloon animals and rushing out of the room. "Come on, Speedy! We're gonna need hotdogs too!"

"I guess we should follow him." Templar98921 shrugs._

Yes, it's GTW beach party time. Bring your own hot dogs. That means we're running out of players, and I gotta be ready in case you finish the game soon. Mackilroy was pure dagnasty evil. RJC Ultra was another innocent. Congrats on getting your first bad guy.

Round Three Votes
jrsh92 -
orcaloverbri9 -
SoItBegins -
Shlimazel -
Templar98921 -
"What is it Clara?"
"Simulated cardiac failure on MAK203 and RJC206."
"Hmm, things seem to be accelerating then. Good, good. How is MRX200?"
"He's spouting more of that gibberish, I think it's his brain fighting us."
"But we're close. This proves we're close. He'll reveal everything soon. He'd better."
"You look worried, doctor."
"They're attacking again."
"Intruder alert! Security fire teams to east corridor, level 8! West side fire teams fall back to level 10!"
"Push him to 99%. And don't lecture me about calibration."

Well, Mack was a terrorist. And dagnasty to boot. That is interesting.

I'm going to maintain my vote for Shilmazel. Last time the people who didn't vote for Mackilroy were me and SoItBegins, who didn't vote. So the guilty is amoung those who voted for Mackilroy and I still feel like I am being set up. Shlimazel was the last to vote for Mack, leaving it to the last second when he realized that Mack was doomed. I wasn't night killed as that would have vindicated me.

Also, I didn't get to go to the beach last time. I like this time.

I would also like to point out that jrsh92 and I also argued during the game where we were both guilty. Although nowhere near as violently.

Oh.

I was on the fence for a while, deciding whether or not to vote for Mackilroy. Then mrxak ended the round.

I guess I was right.

Round Three Votes
jrsh92 -
orcaloverbri9 -
SoItBegins -
Shlimazel -
Templar98921 - Shlimazel

You got less than 31 hours to vote.

You know, orcaloverbri9 was curiously silent the first round. Then, in the second round he voted for Mackilroy like all the rest-- however, it seems to me as though he's been avoiding attention.

orca: While I'm not suspicious enough to vote for you yet, your behavior is rather funny. Please explain yourself.

In the first round I had little to contribute, and realized that at the time of posting my vote would do no good while running the risk of making people target me over my choice. In the second round I was the second one to vote for Mackilroy, so you could hardly say I was covering for being a terrorist. I genuinely thought he might be evil, and I was right.

Trust me when I say you do not want to kill me. (Unless you're a terrorist?)

appears for his death post

So I'm dead. Have fun everyone. It'll be interesting to see if you catch the other terrorists.

raises eyebrows Terrorists? Plural?

Shlimazel , simply because I have no bloody idea who to vote for but Templar's reasoning seems, you know, reasonable.

jrsh92 said:

I have no bloody idea who to vote for

Join the club.

@mackilroy, on Aug 22 2008, 11:03 PM, said in GTW Game 29:

terrorists

Oh dear.

The round will end in less than 3 hours.

Round Three Votes
jrsh92 - Shlimazel
orcaloverbri9 -
SoItBegins -
Shlimazel -
Templar98921 - Shlimazel
"All security fire teams fall back to level 10!"
"Geez, that doesn't sound good."
"Just stay calm, the general says reinforcements are on the way."
"We're dangerously close to brain damage here, doctor."
"Just keep monitoring their vitals."

Round over. Edits incoming. Nobody has PMed me yet... I kinda have to wait on them.

Sorry folks, what with the delays and me going to sleep, I figured I'd just continue the game tonight at midnight, that way you get a full 48 for the next round.