I suppose that could be correct- I had always assumed that it was showing Durandal's ship, the Sfiera/Boomer. I suppose that it could have been the Battlegroup Three Flagship. But does anyone have any comments on the title?

Back to arguing: Maybe BOBs and Fighters shouldn't capture a ship, but Marines definitely should. Otherwise there would be no way that either the Sfiera or the Kfhiva would have been captured. (I think) The first is a pivotal point, the second somewhat important as well.

Let's assume (or at least not mention any contrary information) that the Nar don't use coal, just a very polluting source. With a periodic action, we could have it spew clouds of back smoke out of the rear. I'll be having some fun with those.

Also, what color scheme should the S'pht'Kr follow? I would be inclined towards the blue defender, but the Defender also comes in bright red- that is another valid color. If anyone has any opinions, please reply.

A request for anyone interested in working on the plugin: Please post whichever races you would be interested in doing. If multiple people do the ships, then the races will be even more polar opposites. Also, when finished with the ship pictures, each player should insert the weapons, except teleporters. I'll do those myself.
I'm already working on the Pfhor (2 Ships) and the UESC (1 Ship)
Darkk's doing the Jjaro.

But we still need Nebulons, Nar, and S'pht'Kr. Probably Darkk should take another, and the other two go to a third member (codename: Tycho)

------------------
-Pallas Athene of Dysian Beta, Obish Consensus Representative
-Nieru Dast, {M}ilitia Aeriane
-Danae Vernius
"Cheaters don't really win, and winners don't really cheat. Unless you're talking politics." -Durandal

I really do want to help with this; despite that I live in another timezone, etc., it would be nice to have something to do with my time...

Even if it does mean being called Tycho.

I should like to do the S'pht'Kr; I have a couple of ideas about them... Has anyone considered the number of vacuum-enabled characters in this game? EVA should be very easy...

Nar or Nebulons... that is the question...

As for S'pht'Kr ships, I think we should have a space-capable Defender, and beyond that the ship classes would be similar to the others, although with different names; more passive, as the name 'Defender' would suggest. Anyway, that's what I want to do.

This should be real good...

------------------
Subcommander g'Var "8 Lightnings" Krai'un
Second in command of the Escort Starbeam.
"CRUISER DESTROYED. 91 remaining" -Ares, chapter 9, Hand Over Fist

Remember, BTW, that not all UESC/G colony ships are like the Marathon , which was made from Deimos. We don't need to make ships that big... In fact, should colony ships be primary vehicles...?

Has Slug seen this at all? I would've thought that he'd want to help... he seems like a Marathon person... Oh wait, he's a little...busy, isn't he?

As for the S'pht'Kr colour scheme: we know that they fire green bolts, and use green for engines and weapon ports, so that's another colour. The Defender is the Elite Guard, too, so we don't know that blue and red are all we get, but I'll go with them, I think. Maybe have fighter and interceptor classes, which are basically the same, but one is slightly faster, more maneuverable and has slightly better weapons, and comes in red.

------------------
Subcommander g'Var "8 Lightnings" Krai'un
Second in command of the Escort Starbeam.
"CRUISER DESTROYED. 91 remaining" -Ares, chapter 9, Hand Over Fist

(This message has been edited by 8 Lightnings (edited 01-14-2001).)

It's just that my personality equates to Leela's, and Darkk's equates to Durandal. What does that leave?

8: If you do decide to do the S'pht'Kr, then remember to equate the ship classes approximately to the existing ship classes: Fighter, Corvette, Destroyer, Battleship, Dreadnought, Assault Carrier, Colony Ship.

Fighter to Dreadnought should be basic combat ships, increasing in size. Assault Carrier should be large and have decreased weapons for troopers and elite. Colony ships have very little except for their ability to create a colony.
Actually, I was thinking: It would be natural, given our Ares experience, to assume that the fighter bay is on the Dreadnought. But actually, the only Dreadnought we know of was the Manus Celer Dei. The Pfhor would undoubtedly have chosen a more common ship (a battleship?) to put their fighters on. It could have also been the Assault Carrier, but we've taken the Assault Carrier to be more of an Assault Transport than a Carrier. However, there's no reason it can't be both, as the name would actually suggest.

--Also, I've got (url="http://"http://caalaklael.tripod.com/pfhor_fighter.jpg")the fighter(/url) uploaded

------------------
-Pallas Athene of Dysian Beta, Obish Consensus Representative
-Nieru Dast, {M}ilitia Aeriane
-Danae Vernius
"Cheaters don't really win, and winners don't really cheat. Unless you're talking politics." -Durandal

(This message has been edited by Pallas Athene (edited 01-14-2001).)

Suggested names of ships (If anyone has a problem with these, particularly the Nar or UESC, tell me. Dk indicates Darkk will fill it in.)

Pfhor
Fighter
Corvette
Destroyer
Battleship
Lochaber
Assault Carrier
Colonizer

UESC
Bomber
Cruiser
Frigate
Battlecruiser
Monitor
Troopship
Colony Ship MkII (The Marathon was a MkI)

S'pht'Kr
Defender
Sentry
Escort
Gunship
Warcruiser
Tranfership
Habilitator

Nar
Bartizan
Gendarme
Aegis
Citadel
Beleaguer
Hauler
Denizen

Nebulon
Rover
Weaver (Fast, maneuverable)
Scavenger
Devourer
Predator
Beaconship
Settler

Jjaro
Drone
Scalpal
Remover
Sterilizer
Dreadnaught
Drone Carrier
Habitat Ship

------------------
-Pallas Athene of Dysian Beta, Obish Consensus Representative
-Nieru Dast, {M}ilitia Aeriane
-Danae Vernius
"Cheaters don't really win, and winners don't really cheat. Unless you're talking politics." -Durandal

(This message has been edited by Pallas Athene (edited 01-14-2001).)

(This message has been edited by Pallas Athene (edited 01-16-2001).)

(This message has been edited by Pallas Athene (edited 01-17-2001).)

Jjaro
Drone
Scalpal
Remover
Sterilizer
Dreadnaught
Drone Carrier
Habitat Ship

Their transported troops should be attack drone and assault drone.

As for the Nebulons, I'm pretty sure they don't HAVE a navy anymore. The Nar enjoyed crushing them, indicating they were powerless to fight back, and the Pfhor slaughtered them outright (Tfear is standing on a Nebulon in the pic of him).

Oh, what color should Jjaro ships be? I'm using chrome for the moment, and I'm not sure it looks that good. Jjaro Dreadnaught should be done soon™.

Oh, as for the Nar ships, please handle them if you can, but remember that most of them are VERY large. As I said before, I'd say their shields (their ships are huge, and thus rather hard to destroy) should be much better than their guns.

------------------
William Darkk, head of the Darkklight Entrepenurial Federation
"Strategic warfare" is code for "killing civilians", and it's my calling. Yeah, it's barbaric. War's supposed to be.

(This message has been edited by Fleet Admiral Darkk (edited 01-15-2001).)

Having talked in the past with the brains behind Marathon. and since I'm the unofficial project coordinator, I'm going to lay down the law here and spit out a few guidlenes:

1. MOST Pfhor ships are sleek, streamlined, and rounded. Exceptions come for engineering purposes, like for fitting weapons are compensating for maneuverability on the larger ships.

2a) Dreadnoughts are rare.

2b) The UESC does not have a dreadnought.

3. The Nar speak only in metaphors. Those ship names are good choices, but don't fit with the Nar and need to be changed.

4. The Nebulons are nomads.

5. The Jjaro are to be extremely rare, and only show their ships for fleeting moments.

------------------
Throughout their history these "unenlightened" beings have continually opposed and fought abuses of power wrought by their own bretheren. We, as the prophets would do well to learn from these Humans.
-Final statement of the Salrilian reformist Sirthis shortly before his execution.

The Nebulons must have a fleet. If they didn't, why would the Nar still be waiting for the warrior with green pee to fly the battlewagons to victory against the Nebulons? There has to be some kind of fleet.

I suppose they don't fit, except the battlewagon, for obvious resons. I should change them. But I'd still like to keep the weapons I designed, just with different names (the weapons will be melee weapons, and I think I can get it right) Therefore, the Battlelance will be the Force Tendril, the Battleflail the Black Whirl. Those OK?

--Bartizan
--Gendarme
--Aegis
--Citadel
--Beleaguer
--Hauler
--Denizen
--
--I consider this metaphor; the Nar displayed his creation and said:
--"I give you my citadel of the stars."

The first five ship classes are actually only different in terms of power; it only increases. In theory, the first five classes could all be decreased in power by a fifth, leaving the UESC "Dreadnought" at the same level of power as the Pfhor Battleship.

However, my Pfhor ship designs are based on a picture Bungie did. I think that at least the corvette design can be assumed to be correct. Then, other Pfhor ships should look similar to establish the similarity in ships.

------------------
-Pallas Athene of Dysian Beta, Obish Consensus Representative
-Nieru Dast, {M}ilitia Aeriane
-Danae Vernius
"Cheaters don't really win, and winners don't really cheat. Unless you're talking politics." -Durandal

(This message has been edited by Pallas Athene (edited 01-14-2001).)

Pfhor fleet size: We know that Battle Group 7 represented about a tenth of the Pfhor naval size, as Durandal told us in M2. The Western Arm was made up of 7 Corvettes, 4 Destroyers, 1 Battleship and 1 Assault Carrier. Therefore, if Durandal was implying that this fleet was a tenth of the naval size, the Pfhor have a measly 130 combatant ships. However, PBGs are made up of multiple arms, so if there are three arms, West, Central, and East, they have around 390 ships, and if there are five, North, South, they have around 650. I would be inclined towards the latter, and this could be helpful to us in the storyline.

S'pht'Kr names:
Fighter - Defender
Corvette - Corvette
Destroyer - Escort
Battleship - Lar Gunship
Assault Carrier - K'lia Carrier
Dreadnought - Narhl Battleship
Colony Ship - Colony Ship

I've got some concepts for the appearances, but Strata's playing up, and I'm not doing too well with the modelling. Still, I'll get there soon. I've got a draft mission plot I'd like to present shortly, with a good 54 missions, total, not counting multiplayer. I'll have to see what you think.
Sincerely, Tycho. snicker

------------------
Subcommander g'Var "8 Lightnings" Krai'un
Second in command of the Escort Starbeam.
"CRUISER DESTROYED. 91 remaining" -Ares, chapter 9, Hand Over Fist

(Durandal)
What, no tipped hat?
(/Durandal)
Me and Sargatanus are handling the plot for now, although input/missions would be welcome.

I've finished modeling the Jjaro Dreadnaught. If you frequent Marathon's Story, the origional guesses for TBWSAF apply here (hint, 2 of the words are swear words). (url="http://"http://www.geocities.com/fadarkk/Dreadnaught01.jpg")http://www.geocities...eadnaught01.jpg(/url)

As for Pfhor fleet size, I'm pretty sure he said ACTIVE in there. That's an important qualifier, they might have many ships in reserve, and given the size/glory of their empire, it's almost certain they have plenty of reserves.

What do you think of my little creation? I think it looks like some demented space-jellyfish, sorta the way I wanted it to.

------------------
William Darkk, head of the Darkklight Entrepenurial Federation
"Strategic warfare" is code for "killing civilians", and it's my calling. Yeah, it's barbaric. War's supposed to be.

(This message has been edited by Fleet Admiral Darkk (edited 01-15-2001).)

I can't say if it's good or not right now- give it a rotated angle, so we can see all three dimensions, and then I'll tell you. As it is it doesn't quite compare to the way the original Ares ships looked.

------------------
-Pallas Athene of Dysian Beta, Obish Consensus Representative
-Nieru Dast, {M}ilitia Aeriane
-Danae Vernius
"Cheaters don't really win, and winners don't really cheat. Unless you're talking politics." -Durandal

Another thing: One of the things I considered when naming ships was that the names were very dissimilar. If possible, change them to be different.

------------------
-Pallas Athene of Dysian Beta, Obish Consensus Representative
-Nieru Dast, {M}ilitia Aeriane
-Danae Vernius
"Cheaters don't really win, and winners don't really cheat. Unless you're talking politics." -Durandal

Quote

Originally posted by Pallas Athene:
**I can't say if it's good or not right now- give it a rotated angle, so we can see all three dimensions, and then I'll tell you. As it is it doesn't quite compare to the way the original Ares ships looked.
**

Alrighty, then. (url="http://"http://www.geocities.com/fadarkk/Dreadnaught02.jpg")http://www.geocities...eadnaught02.jpg(/url) for a front shot (not a very good angle in my opinion) and (url="http://"http://www.geocities.com/fadarkk/Dreadnaught03.jpg")http://www.geocities...eadnaught03.jpg(/url) for a rear shot.

I've spent some time on this, and really hope it's ok. It certaintly fits MY conception of how the Jjaro ships look; it doesn't have wear because the material is some sort of super-metal that lasts pretty much forever.

If you think it needs more character, I could try blending some different chromes, or maybe some hybrid grey/green/brown texture.

Also, I changed the names some. You like?

------------------
William Darkk, head of the Darkklight Entrepenurial Federation
"Strategic warfare" is code for "killing civilians", and it's my calling. Yeah, it's barbaric. War's supposed to be.

(This message has been edited by Fleet Admiral Darkk (edited 01-15-2001).)

Good. just make sure you give it that third dimension in the final version.
(Note: we should probably keep the camera angles the same. How about a ratio of X:Y:Z movement of 0:1:2, or 0:2:1 in Strata?)

Sorry, but I don't like some of those S'pht'Kr names.
Defender
Sentry
Escort
Gunship
Warcruiser
Tranfership
Habilitator

------------------
-Pallas Athene of Dysian Beta, Obish Consensus Representative
-Nieru Dast, {M}ilitia Aeriane
-Danae Vernius
"Cheaters don't really win, and winners don't really cheat. Unless you're talking politics." -Durandal

Me, I'm going to try to visualy approximate the angles of the ships in Ares. I suggest we do that. I'm pretty sure they're only tilted in one axis, but they're rotated to make it look like they're tilted in more. For now, I'm going to work with aspect ratios, as I'm not sure orthographic projection will work even with some angle...

------------------
William Darkk, head of the Darkklight Entrepenurial Federation
"Strategic warfare" is code for "killing civilians", and it's my calling. Yeah, it's barbaric. War's supposed to be.

Hmmm... I think we should have some standardized point where we put the cameras. My suggestion was essantially up 100, over 50. That's about a 3/4 angle (Don't ask me to calculate it precisely), and it certainly seemed to work with the Landsraad ships I had rendered. I'll do one of my ships nice and big at that angle for evaluation. When I can.

--Also, I changed some ships names above. I added some Nebulons for eval too.

------------------
-Pallas Athene of Dysian Beta, Obish Consensus Representative
-Nieru Dast, {M}ilitia Aeriane
-Danae Vernius
"Cheaters don't really win, and winners don't really cheat. Unless you're talking politics." -Durandal

(This message has been edited by Pallas Athene (edited 01-16-2001).)

Oh, I think the UESG "Dreadnaught" catagory ship should be the Missle Destroyer, which has shields slightly less than the battleship but tons of long-range firepower (warp capable fusion missles, perchance) and maybe a wave motion gun (which I think should be the colony-eraser for the humans).

(This message has been edited by Fleet Admiral Darkk (edited 01-16-2001).)

-The Wave Motion gun should be a gigantic Tesla Coil (in appearance) High-Yield Nuclear Weapons would destroy colonies best (We're crude, aren't we?).
-But then again, why are we talking about the UNS Dreadnought here? What about the UESC Dreadnought?
-Have we agreed that fighters will be on Assault Carriers?

-Multiplayer maps:
-Lucky Seven: Two opposing planets with another 5 uncolonized planets a random distance from the center.
-Crossfire: N/S Planets for one player, capable of little production, Player 2 E/W. Center planet without outpost but can build everything once has outpost.
-Fringe: (My favorite) Top Secret. I'll email everyone the details. It's long to write out too.

------------------
-Pallas Athene of Dysian Beta, Obish Consensus Representative
-Nieru Dast, {M}ilitia Aeriane
-Danae Vernius
"Cheaters don't really win, and winners don't really cheat. Unless you're talking politics." -Durandal

Just got to see the pictures (now I'm on iCab not Lynx) and I really like them. I can't see much living space in the Dreadnought, but who cares...

I didn't like the names too much myself either; those are a bit better. I was just thinking of putting a little of what we know of S'pht language in them (Narhl - Vengeance, Lar - Freedom). Yeah, I like your ones better.

I love the net levels, too. How many weapons will we be able to have on our ships? Are we going to have to reserve a weapon for the troopers and elites?

Anyway, this is going to be a cool plug when it's finished.

Well, it had better be...

------------------
Subcommander g'Var "8 Lightnings" Krai'un
Second in command of the Escort Starbeam.
"CRUISER DESTROYED. 91 remaining" -Ares, chapter 9, Hand Over Fist

I'd certainly agreed fighters go on assault carriers. What should their nearest equivilent be, Dreadnought, Battleship, or Destroyer? I'd love to know...

Of course, it could be different per race, with associated cost fluctuations, like the way the Sal carrier is almost their HVD, and the Aud gunship is pretty much their HVD...

Also, do the Carriers and Dreadnoughts have 1 teleporter or 2? How about other ships? Or is it up to the designer?

(update)
I've finished the model for the Drone Carrier. Yes, it is somewhat similar to the Dreadnought, but you've got to expect some similarites. Standard order, 1 is top, 2 is front, 3 is rear. (url="http://"http://www.geocities.com/fadarkk/JDC01.jpg")http://www.geocities...darkk/JDC01.jpg(/url) (url="http://"http://www.geocities.com/fadarkk/JDC02.jpg")http://www.geocities...darkk/JDC02.jpg(/url) (url="http://"http://www.geocities.com/fadarkk/JDC03.jpg")http://www.geocities...darkk/JDC03.jpg(/url)

Also, I have experamentally verified that the way the Ares ships are set up is that the primary rotation is made, and then the ship is tilted 45° along the axis running horizontally across the screen (in my case, the x axis). The test results (yes, they look like crud, I was trying to do it fast) are here: (url="http://"http://www.geocities.com/fadarkk/test.jpg")http://www.geocities...adarkk/test.jpg(/url) WARNING: It's a big image.

(/update)

------------------
Never fly in front when attacking a Jjaro ship. -Me

(This message has been edited by Fleet Admiral Darkk (edited 01-17-2001).)