Alright, from the other convo about the ringworlds on the evn message board I've come up with quite a few idea's. And hopefully some of the people in the developers corner will be able to help me make them happen. First off, Kont is the only known world that you can mine Palladinium from. But that may only be because the other ring world Kelar'ly isn't widly explored by the polaris, which I doubt, or they never saw fit to tell us they have palladinium. If the palladinium is nessisary for hypergate travel, then maybe more and more massive amount can create variations in space and change the destination from point to point, to something else. Being through time or going to another universe. I'm thinking that at the begginning of the story line I could simply string out a few missions explaining about Kont, and Kelar'ly ant why they were built. The idea being the players discovering that they are both massive hypergates through time, or to another demension. That I could do fairly simply on my own as the first part of the story. But after that it'll become a total conversion, where the players are transported from one universe to the next. With a whole new string of missions, ships, weapons, everything. That's when I'll need somebodys help, I haven't the faintest how to make this work as yet, because I dont completely understand the EVN system for all the new features. I'm used to the nice simple EV system thanks. If you have any idea's that might help me out, or are interested in helping me with this new project, post here or email me at moonlesskey@fastmail.fm
(EDIT)
I've removed this part of my post on the grounds that it was pointless and offensive to the more touchy people.

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Prime...Awacins

(This message has been edited by Prime (edited 01-29-2004).)

I don't frankly care if it seriously displeases you really. If you don't know how Nova works very well and you're planning what's effectively a total conversion-scale plugin, then I don't rate your chances. Nova is a big jump from EV/O, and it's a lot more work overall.

And I don't appreciate you telling people what they can and cannot say - you post things and people post what they want in response. That's how a webboard works, and you don't have any right to declare that you want to be an exception.

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(url="http://"http://www.mazca.com/")mazca(/url), king of pork
Ruling with an iron fist
The pig farms fear him

Easy Mazca. I can almost see steam coming out of your ears. Some people do programming. Some do graphics. Some just come up with an idea and a story.

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((Ż'ˇ.¸(Ż'ˇ.¸Ť•-KAME-•ť¸.ˇ'´Ż)¸.ˇ'´Ż))
I used to jog but the ice kept falling out of my glass.
(url="http://"http://www.0three0.net/l-1551/")L 1551(/url) - The official site of RONIN and The Way and the ten thousand things

Quote

Originally posted by Kame:
**Easy Mazca. I can almost see steam coming out of your ears. Some people do programming. Some do graphics. Some just come up with an idea and a story.

**

Sorry, no steam coming out of my ears. I just felt he deserved that after his stroppy closing paragraph.

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(url="http://"http://www.mazca.com/")mazca(/url), king of pork
Ruling with an iron fist
The pig farms fear him

Graphic's, C++, and storys are my domain. I'm well aware that EVN is a big leap from the other games, and chewing me out for wanting to give it my damndest isn't going to help anything. I put that last paragraph is there because I didn't want to hear s*** like that, seeing as it dosn't work I think I'll just ignore the people like you. Who seem to like to make life as hard as possible for the rest of us. Saying things like this is not the way to go, I want the game to be enjoyable to others. And if you give me crap for that, you can go straight to hell. If you want a personal war with me, just email me. But keep it off the message boards, it wont help a damn thing. I would just let you get away with your attatude since your a moderator, but since I've never respected athority you can go straight to hell. Take away all the damn Karma points you want as revenge. Now is anybody gonna help me out or was it compleatly useless to ask for help in the first place?

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Prime...Awacins

Hmm...I think I hear the sound of an un-sheathing Karmastick...

Anyways: Good idea, but hard to do. I know that you are just trying to throw ideas around, but you have to understand, that this gets asked a lot. (url="http://"http://www.ambrosiasw.com/webboard/Forum9/HTML/004829.html")In fact, it was brought up here not too long ago(/url). I like the idea and all, but coming up with a story, and then asking a group of people to just make it is silly. If you really want to do it, start practicing plugin making. When you have got a handle on the engine, start to make the plug. If you stick with it, people will notice, and eventually will voulenteer to help. Good pluck with the plug. I hope you understand where we're coming from.

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ATTs Official Newb, And Znorty's official Sidekick. "All hail fearless leader."
Dammit. (url="http://"mailto:lotsofblackflags@yahoo.com")mailto:lotsofblackflags@yahoo.com(/url)lotsofblackflags@yahoo.com

He's right you know, Prime.

People don't really like requests because they're annoying.

You should do some experimentation first.

A while ago, I had an idea for a TC that took place on the sea. I realized it was impossible with the current engine, so I turned my attention to a space-based TC. I don't have the best grasp on the engine and I don't have the Bible engraved into the back of my head, but I have the general idea of its limitations and I'm learning as I go along.

As you should be.

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When viewing a Terrapin for the first time, I realized that anything flies-if you throw it hard enough!

Quote

Originally posted by Prime:
**And I dont want to hear anything from the other developers in regaurds to 'you'll nver finish it' as I've gotten before. Either try and help, give my idea's. Or keep your mouths shut. If you dont have anything nice to say dont say anything at all. Your lack of faith seriously displeases me.

**

So much for putting your best foot forward...

Seriously I would like to see what you can do. I have the faith that you can do anything you put your mind to do. However it is always best to take on the project and give it a start and some direction before you ask for help. Otherwise how will you know what you can or can't do? More to the point how would you remain in control of what is developed unless your doing it yourself? Are you willing to sit back and let someone else take a few sentances that show your idea and then make something from it and maybe not even in a direction that you have envissioned? If so then how would it even be your project? Especially when you are recruiting others to do the work.

Sorry if this seems like I am tearing into you but that is not what I am about. I hope that you look at these comments in a positive light and take to heart the suggestion that you give this a try on your own and start to build something to a point where when you do need some help that others will be glad to lend a hand.

Good luck and I hope to see your project take shape.

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Nothing like the smell of burnt rubber in the morning. - Now let's see some Tiresmoke!
(url="http://"http://www.rsdg.net")www.rsdg.net(/url)

Why don't you come up with a compelling backstory for your total conversion idea? Nobody will help you just because of one or two paragraphs of very basic background information, because there are at least twelve or so other people before you who have done the same thing; namely, have written a bit of background info soliciting assistance, promised that their project will come to fruition, and have disappeared, never to be seen again.

Even I had to do some writing before I got Azdara to sign on. But now he knows the basic plot of Retribution, and he's all the happier because of it.

I don't see why I should have faith in you. I can't even assure myself 100% that no matter what happens, I'll get done with my own project (although there's certainly nothing I can think of, and I've thought long and hard, that will impede progress), and many of the people on the webboard think the same, so it's a tall order to ask them to place their trust in you.

But if you write a good backstory, post it here, and maybe draw a few mock-ups of ships you want to see, detail governments and races and such, you'll start getting takers, people who actually know what they'll be getting into.

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Retribution: An Upcoming Plug-in for EVN.
Visit the (url="http://"http://www.ambrosiasw.com/cgi-bin/ubb/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&number;=20&SUBMIT;=Go")Chronicles(/url) today! Be sure to read the short story ' (url="http://"http://www.ambrosiasw.com/cgi-bin/ubb/newsdisplay.cgi?action=topics &number;=20&forum;=*EV/EVO+chronicles&DaysPrune;=100&article;=000262&startpoint;=")Fiery Descent(/url)'!
(url="http://"http://www.cwssoftware.com")Sephil Saga(/url): An upcoming TC, visit the web page today.| | | Both the best and the worst plug-in editor for Windows! (url="http://"http://www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW")EVNEW(/url)!

(This message has been edited by UE_Research & Development (edited 01-29-2004).)

Prime, get real. Just because you like your idea, doesn't mean you're going to finish. You see all these TCs in progress and think "oh, that must be easy". Wrong. A TC for EVC or EVO was a lot of work. EVN is at least double that. Sorry, but the odds are against you. And if you think that just because you want to make a TC, you can, you are sorely mistaken. When you have a major update, let us know and we'll consider the possibility of it becoming a reality. Until then, the countless vaporware plug-ins show that your odds ain't high. It is not crap. It is the truth. Claiming that we're wrong and you're right because you came up with some random vague idea for a TC is just arrogant, foolish, and ignorant. We are trying to enlighten you. You can't do whatever you think you can.

You also don't know that you won't give this project up in favor of another one. I had a plug-in for EVC, which turned into a plug-in for EVO, which turned into an MS for EVO, which turned into a quasi-TC* for EVN. I have abandoned it because I like my new idea better. Only one person has a good idea of what I'm up to, and I intend to keep it that way till shortly before release. No teasers, no advertising. One day, if I complete it, I'll just say, bam, I'm coming out with a TC, it's done except for graphics (which I totally suck at), bet you weren't expecting that.

Don't be a moron. Be sensible and take our advice. Look at the Nova scenario. If the amount of resources is daunting, you ain't ready.

* UE R&D;

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The programmer's code of entomology: there's always another bug.
Windows users: stop asking for plugins. (url="http://"http://www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW/")Make one yourself.(/url)
(url="http://"http://www.cwssoftware.com")Sephil Saga Website(/url)
(url="http://"http://www.evula.org/infernostudios/search.html")Add-ons Search Engine(/url)

(This message has been edited by orcaloverbri9 (edited 01-29-2004).)

Well, after the enitial chewing out this was mostly helpful, only Orca's was bit harsh. In any case, I shall start on my first plug-in on my own. I have the Nova bible and I'll do my best to attract some attention from you guys, thanks for the advice. And Orce, if you need help with Graphic's email me. I don't know how to insert them into EVN cough yet cough but I certainly can make you quite a few killer ships if you give me some time.

moonlesskey@fastmail.fm

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Prime...Awacins

Quote

Originally posted by Prime:
Orca's was bit harsh

...which is why I don't make statements like your last paragraph. Yes, it was harsh, but sometimes it has to be (but not too harsh).

Quote

And Orce, if you need help with Graphic's email me. I don't know how to insert them into EVN cough yet cough but I certainly can make you quite a few killer ships if you give me some time.

moonlesskey@fastmail.fm

Thanks! I'll email you if/when I get to that point. Hopefully I'll have some concept art worked out by then.

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The programmer's code of entomology: there's always another bug.
Windows users: stop asking for plugins. (url="http://"http://www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW/")Make one yourself.(/url)
(url="http://"http://www.cwssoftware.com")Sephil Saga Website(/url)
(url="http://"http://www.evula.org/infernostudios/search.html")Add-ons Search Engine(/url)

(This message has been edited by orcaloverbri9 (edited 01-29-2004).)

You dont have to be harsh with me, I'm reasonable. I totally expect people to say what I'm doing is impossible, I put that in because I didn't want them to be ######s about it. They are most of the time. If any of you need any help from me feel free to ask. I can do landingphotoes and ships, stations. But I cant do planets, I'm a no go in that area. I'm a perfectionist and I can never get planets to look right. Your best bet is to get pictures off the web and shrink em.

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Prime...Awacins

Quote

Originally posted by Prime:
**You dont have to be harsh with me, I'm reasonable. I totally expect people to say what I'm doing is impossible, I put that in because I didn't want them to be ######s about it. They are most of the time. If any of you need any help from me feel free to ask. I can do landingphotoes and ships, stations. But I cant do planets, I'm a no go in that area. I'm a perfectionist and I can never get planets to look right. Your best bet is to get pictures off the web and shrink em.

**

**Maybe it'd be better if you showed a bit more respect to us in the future as opposed to calling us "######s" and such. I've found that people are much more helpful that way.

_bomb

**

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"that'll be 15 cents hippie!"

Bomb hit the nail on the head Prime.

We tend to get a little annoyed when someone who knows nothing about plug in making comes in here and tells us how their plug is different, and that we are all 'arseholes' for telling you the blatant truth. Your plug will not likely ever see the light of day. I'm sorry, telling me to go to hell won't change that, it just makes you look like a fool. Don't come in here telling us what to say, and asking for help with one side of your face, but abusing us with the other.

That is the way you get NO help. You don't want that do you?

Respect the fact that many people here have been developing stuff for a lot longer than you, have seen thousands of posts like this, with people starting some great new plug that will be totally finished, and totally different from the others, and how many of them have we seen come to fruition? Not a single one.

So, when we seem a little... negative in our attitudes, take it with a grain of salt. Understand that we all know the bitterness of a project going tits up, and that true dedication is a rare and valuable thing. And that most rare of things is the only way to get a plug done. Does that fact make us arseholes?

If you want to deny the odds, then fine, stick your head in the sand. If you want to prove me wrong, even better, that'd be great. But don't expect me, or anyone here to come out all smiling and laughing because "Hooray!" someone has come up with another plug idea. We've seen them come, we've seen them go. Not many can do it.

This isn't to say that you can't do it, and on that point you have my full encouragement (not support, after your attitude I don't really want to do anything for you) and hope that you do get somewhere. But judging from experience, it is almost a duty for me to warn you: You might, and probably will give up.

Sucks, don't it?

Also: Mazca wouldn't drop your karma for a good, normal debate. Don't try to use the fact that he is a moderator against him. I've never known him not to be within the bounds of common sense and common courtesy undeservedly. I think you should quit being pissed off at him, drop your stupid anti authoritarian attitude, and get on with being a productive member of this board. You know where antiauthoritarian attitudes come from? Wishing that you were the one in authority. He's there, you're not, deal with it. Theres no need or gain in being a mindless rebel on a webboard. It's just lame.

All that negative **** outta the way, and I say 'good luck' to you, and I do mean it.

~A~

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"How can I make it go faster?" -Me-

Quote

Originally posted by Prime:
You dont have to be harsh with me, I'm reasonable. I totally expect people to say what I'm doing is impossible, I put that in because I didn't want them to be ######s about it. They are most of the time.

I used to be like that. Then I got karmaslapped. I wasn't trying to imply I had to be harsh—but it's best for me to maintain a standard and not try and be extremely harsh sometimes and nice others.

Quote

If any of you need any help from me feel free to ask. I can do landingphotoes and ships, stations. But I cant do planets, I'm a no go in that area. I'm a perfectionist and I can never get planets to look right. Your best bet is to get pictures off the web and shrink em.

Thanks again! I won't be needing your services yet, but I will in the future.

Note: I'm trying to remain neutral now. Good luck on your TC. I've given you the harsh truth already, no reason for me to do it again.

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The programmer's code of entomology: there's always another bug.
Windows users: stop asking for plugins. (url="http://"http://www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW/")Make one yourself.(/url)
(url="http://"http://www.cwssoftware.com")Sephil Saga Website(/url)
(url="http://"http://www.evula.org/infernostudios/search.html")Add-ons Search Engine(/url)

(This message has been edited by orcaloverbri9 (edited 01-29-2004).)

YOu guys have givin me enough harsh truth, that's why I'm a little T'd. I've completed plug's before, it just takes a whole lot longer when nobody will help. And quite frankly I'm still working on one, now that Nova's out its made it one hell of a bitch.

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Prime...Awacins

Quote

You know where antiauthoritarian attitudes come from? Wishing that you were the one in authority.

I haven't seen a truer statment in a v-e-r-y long time.

Quote

That's when I'll need somebodys help...

Be more specific. Do you need someone to write missions? Write descs? Code? Make ship graphics? Beta-test? Consult with you concerning the accuracy of your source material? Being specific helps.

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Retribution: An Upcoming Plug-in for EVN.
Visit the (url="http://"http://www.ambrosiasw.com/cgi-bin/ubb/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&number;=20&SUBMIT;=Go")Chronicles(/url) today! Be sure to read the short story ' (url="http://"http://www.ambrosiasw.com/cgi-bin/ubb/newsdisplay.cgi?action=topics &number;=20&forum;=*EV/EVO+chronicles&DaysPrune;=100&article;=000262&startpoint;=")Fiery Descent(/url)'!
(url="http://"http://www.cwssoftware.com")Sephil Saga(/url): An upcoming TC, visit the web page today.| | | Both the best and the worst plug-in editor for Windows! (url="http://"http://www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW")EVNEW(/url)!

Specifically I'd need them to insert script, systems, missions, and graphics into the game. Graphics, writing, and actual system configurations I could do on my own. What I'd need people to do is focus on certain problem so I can keep my eye on the entirity of the project.

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Prime...Awacins

Personally, I find that a good way to learn something like this, is to start a project, of any size, and you will learn as you go.

You are certainly right that you can't do it alone, and the best way to get other people is to start by yourself. As soon as you have a bunch of stuff written, and ready, you will be able to find people to help you.

You might also find that you can pick up Nova plug-in development pretty quickly, and that you enjoy having the total control over your project because you are the one who actually puts it into the game.

Either way, the way to start is to pick up some of it yourself and go to work on the idea.

In regards to everyone berating people about their TC ideas, its just because there are tons of people coming onto these boards with nothing planned ahead of time, who say that their project will be the best. So, just keep that in mind and don't get too mad at everyone.

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