Ambrosia Garden Archive
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    • Override Graphic Limitation Question

       EV Developer's Corner
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      Lately I've been working on my new plug for EV Override, EV: Omega. Unfortunetly, I've come to a point that raises a question for me.

      According to the EVO Bible, ther max number of Outfits is 128, with PICT ID's starting at 6000. Thumbnails start at 6101. The problem is, that the 101st item (PICT 6101) can't exist, because it would conflict with the thumbnail of outfit #1.

      6000 ... 6101
      6001 ... 6102
      ...
      6099 ... 6200
      6100? ... 6201?
      6101 is where the delema comes in.

      The question is: Is there any way to get graphics for all 128 outfits, or am I limited to 100 outfits with graphics, and 28 without graphics?

      (BTW, to those who are interested, currently, I have 112 outfits ready, 25 weapons, 64 ships, 600 systems, 9 major governments, and 80 planets ready and working. Slated release of the plug is Mid 2003.)

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      Captain Z - Mobile Operations Commander of the (url="http://"http://www.literatureclassics.com/68kmla")68K Macintosh Liberation Army(/url)
      18 68K Macintoshes Liberated
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      (url="http://"http://homepage.mac.com/captainz")Captain Z's New and Improved Starbase of EV Stuff(/url)

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      I'm not entirely sure, but I believe that the pict that would go at 6101 ends up at 6102 instead, and they go on from there.

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      (url="http://"http://www.rit.edu/~jxc1906/")(Insert Signature Here)(/url)

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      Quote

      Originally written in the EVO Developer's Bible
      Any resources in an Override plugin file automatically replace same-numbered resources in Override’s main files. Additional graphics for the shipyard and outfit dialog menus (just individual menu items, not the whole menu!) are loaded from PICT ID’s 5101 and up for shipyard and 6101 and up for outfit. (e.g. 5101 is the first ship type, 5105 is the fifth, etc., and the same goes for the outfit menu items) These menu items will replace the respective ones in the main menu resources, PICTs 5100 and 6100.

      The problem with what your saying, Wyvern, is that I can't use any number between 6101 and 6200 as the outfit picture because that would override the Thumbnail for each corresponding outfit (6000-6099). PICT 6100 (Thumbnail 6201) can't be used because it is the grid of outfit thumbnails normally.

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      Captain Z - Mobile Operations Commander of the (url="http://"http://www.literatureclassics.com/68kmla")68K Macintosh Liberation Army(/url)
      18 68K Macintoshes Liberated
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      (url="http://"http://homepage.mac.com/captainz")Captain Z's New and Improved Starbase of EV Stuff(/url)

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      What I think Wyvern was saying was that if you go over 6100, then the thumbnails will be pushed back.

      Matrix

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      "Nothing is fool-proof to a sufficiently talented fool."

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      Matt added a work-around in EVO 1.0.2. The large outfit pictures past ID 6099, are now stored in IDs 6300-6327.

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      Quote

      Originally posted by MadFax7:
      **Matt added a work-around in EVO 1.0.2. The large outfit pictures past ID 6099, are now stored in IDs 6300-6327.

      **

      So:

      6098 ... 6199
      6099 ... 6200
      jump to
      6300 ... 6401
      6301 ... 6402

      Am I correct in that?

      Thanks for the help!

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      Captain Z - Mobile Operations Commander of the (url="http://"http://www.literatureclassics.com/68kmla")68K Macintosh Liberation Army(/url)
      18 68K Macintoshes Liberated
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      (url="http://"http://homepage.mac.com/captainz")Captain Z's New and Improved Starbase of EV Stuff(/url)

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      Quote

      Originally posted by Captain Z:
      **So:

      6098 ... 6199
      6099 ... 6200
      jump to
      6300 ... 6401
      6301 ... 6402

      Am I correct in that?**

      No. The small outfit pictures are still stored in IDs 6100-6227. Only the last 28 large outfit pictures have different IDs.

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      hmm I believe the problem with what you are encountering is that when EVO was created, the team developers didn't add spacers, meaning a desc, pict, or outf for things that was never intended for the player to access. For example, the Igadzra governement's ship who can't be hailed, that would mean that you would not be able to see the profile image of their ship because you are unable to unhail them in the first place. Therefore, no pict for the comm was added to the game. I personally think they should of as well as other things as well, like the marine gear or the enhanced neutron turrets. Which would make it easier on plug-in developers. But because of the lack of number of resources I believe it could confuse someone more than ever and you would never hear the end of it. I guess that's why they filled the gaps for EVN, just in case someone wanted to make certain ships or items free and wouldn't have to go through all that trouble in created additional descs and STR's and outfs for it. Believe me I know, when I created Armory Galores and Ships Galore for EVO.

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      Nosumus Fortiolis Quad Volimus

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      Quote

      Originally posted by Coraxus:
      hmm I believe the problem with what you are encountering is that when EVO was created, the team developers didn't add spacers, meaning a desc, pict, or outf for things that was never intended for the player to access.

      We are not talking about problems with the scenerio, but the engine. When Matt made EVC, he set the outfit max to 128, except he set them to use picture IDs 6000-6100 (for the large 100x100 ones) and, 6100-6228. (for the small 32x32 icons.) That meant that oütf IDs 229 and up could not be used for buyable outfits. (unless you want them to have no picture, that is.)

      This limitation was then carried over to EVO. The work-around discussed above, was added later, when version 1.0.2 came out, after much pestering during the feature-request period.

      Quote

      Originally posted by Coraxus:
      ...I personally think they should of as well as other things as well, like the marine gear or the enhanced neutron turrets. Which would make it easier on plug-in developers.

      I agree that they should've added the comm pic for the Igazra, since you can see that in-game if you capture one, however, anything that is not viewable in-game, without plugins, should be left entirely up to the plugin developer. Plus I think it lowers the number of cheater plugs, which, needless to say, is good.

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      Originally posted by Coraxus:
      But because of the lack of number of resources I believe it could confuse someone more than ever and you would never hear the end of it.

      No punctuation is infinately more confusing. 😛

      Quote

      Originally posted by Coraxus:
      I guess that's why they filled the gaps for EVN, just in case someone wanted to make certain ships or items free...

      I am fairly certain that ATMOS was not intending them to be used for cheater plugs.

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      Quote

      Originally posted by MadFax7:
      **Matt added a work-around in EVO 1.0.2. The large outfit pictures past ID 6099, are now stored in IDs 6300-6327.
      **

      Except that the outfit picts still do not display correctly. I believe that you can go up to about ID # 110-115 (don't remember exactly, I'll check it and post the correct numbers later. Anyway, point is you still cannot have a full 128 purchasable outfits with pictures even in EV:O 1.0.2, so the higher numbers are best reserved for things that will not be available in the outfitters, such as integral fighter bays and alien tech.

      edit: (dammned numeric dyslexia) the pics start breaking down at about the ID# 240 range, noy what I wrote above.
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      Joe Burnette
      "I find that humans can be divided into only two meaningful categories: Decent Humans and Sonsofbitches; both types appear to be evenly distributed among all shapes, colors, sizes, and nationalities." -- Keith Laumer

      (This message has been edited by Joe Burnette (edited 06-19-2002).)

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      Quote

      Originally posted by Joe Burnette:
      Except that the outfit picts still do not display correctly. I believe that you can go up to about ID # 110-115 (don't remember exactly, I'll check it and post the correct numbers later. Anyway, point is you still cannot have a full 128 purchasable outfits with pictures even in EV:O 1.0.2, so the higher numbers are best reserved for things that will not be available in the outfitters, such as integral fighter bays and alien tech.

      Hmmm, I never noticed that. Once you go past outfit 241, (picture ID 6313 and 6214) the small (icon sized) pictures dissapear. However, the large ones are still displayed correctly. It should be noted that the "Teeny Outfit Pics" (6100) will work for all outfits.

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      Originally posted by MadFax7:
      **... It should be noted that the "Teeny Outfit Pics" (6100) will work for all outfits.
      **

      How? I've tried replacing PICT # 6100 with a new one showing additional outfits but could never get it to display correctly.

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      Joe Burnette
      "I find that humans can be divided into only two meaningful categories: Decent Humans and Sonsofbitches; both types appear to be evenly distributed among all shapes, colors, sizes, and nationalities." -- Keith Laumer

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      Quote

      Originally posted by Joe Burnette:
      How? I've tried replacing PICT # 6100 with a new one showing additional outfits but could never get it to display correctly.

      All I did was paste a 256x512 pict into ResEdit, and change it's ID to 6100.

      However, I was apparently wrong about the patch-icon pictures not showing up, because I spent the last hour or so making (url="http://"http://homepage.mac.com/madfax7/.cv/madfax7/Public/Plugins/pict_template.sit.hqx-binhex.hqx")this plugin(/url), and they work fine in it.

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