Nova hasn't been out even a week, but I wonder about plans any of you may have to develop Nova plugs set in the EV universe - either brand new plugs or ports of old favorites. Anyone thinking along those lines?
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"Your death will be the proof that Horus does not lie."
Roger Zelazny, Creatures of Light and Darkness
Oh my, a new post on the EV board... this is certainly a rare occurance. Glad to know I'm not the only one who comes here. 
As for the topic at hand, once there is an EV->EVN port, I'll be "porting" my 3D Targets and Black Panel plugins to use that plugin (I'm also working on my own 3D targets plugin for EVN, although stripping ships away from the gradient does take quite a bit of time).
If I had any spare time to devote to creating a great plugin, I would revive a few that I've had sitting around for several years, and do them as EVN-native (one is a TC, so that would be easy enough to do). If I could get a team together so that I don't have to do all the work, I'd be more than willing to get it going.
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(url="http://"http://www.evula.com/")EVula,(/url) your friendly (url="http://"http://www.evula.com/")self-promoting(/url) EV & EVO Boards/Addon/Newswire/Chronicles moderator
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Nova certainly raises the bar for graphics and ammount of work needed to make a plugin.
You can except 50-75% less plugins for Nova, but a huge increase in quality. It used to be that any idiot wieh Schmelta V could improve EV. With Nova, that will actually take work. (Of course, the Nova Tools will be a huge help)
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(This message has been edited by OctoberFost (edited 03-22-2002).)
After spending a good half an hour mucking around with Nova's guts, invalidating the checksum (By pasting the templates in), and then reinstalling the game, I can honestly say that Nova's scenario format is intimidating to say the least. As a graphic artist, I realize now that it's going to take alot more effort on my part to create ship graphics. I have a set of tools that helped to streamline the process for EV which are all worthless now. Joy.
For the time being, I will continue to concentrate all my efforts on finishing the New Republic plugin. However, Porting it to Nova will be a serious pain in the ass. The reason being, it still uses alot of scattered resources from the EV universe. We'll either have to port the EV Universe first, then NR, or we could paste the EV Resources into a group of files followed by a group of NR resources over the EV stuff. We're still talking about a really fricken big plug.
Once I'm done with New Republic, I've got alot of personal work I've done for EV over the past couple of years. It's all based on a post-EV universe (Like we havn't heard that one before) but I'm seriously considering porting at least a little bit of it to Nova. We'll see how things go. Just to warn you, It probably won't happen in this life time.
-AJ
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"I live my life a quarter-mile at a time." - Dominic Toretto, The Fast And The Furious
EVula: I have always poked around with the idea of getting involved in a large plug-in effort, but my only real attempt (Erion: The Worlds Beyond) sort of died because I was unorganized and evetually lost interest when I started running into large problems (namely, the graphics I was making were hard to render, implement, etc. and a few problems with the storyline).
Once I have some time to read the bible more thoroughly and learn more about Nova as far as development goes, I may be able to help somewhat if you are ever assembling a team.
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--ares
"You have not converted a man because you have silenced him."
-John Morley
Will, I'll begin by saying that there will still be people playing EV plug-ins because they can't play Nova (me being one of those people).
Another thing is that if you do make a great plug-in, regardless of what engine it's on, people are going to play it and enjoy it, and it'll become a part of the EV legacy. Now to make things even better, wOOtware's Port Authority will make EV plug-ins playable in Nova, so that won't even be a problem.
So anyway...one other thing, regarding the mention of development teams. I know teamwork is a great thing and that the concept of a team is almost always a good one, for plug-in creation I don't know if I believe in a real team. If you take a look at all the really good plug-ins out there (EVGE, Frozen Heart, Star Wars, Empire I think, etc.), they were made by small groups of people, and there was generally one guy who was in charge of 90% of the project. One thing I've found about working over the Internet is that it something that's really difficult. You have to take the time and effort to just coordinate the project and everything, and occasionally you run into disagreements, but the difficulties of coordination just make it troublesome to create a plug-in properly.
I'm not saying a team effort wouldn't work, but I'm just making a conclusion based off the fact that almost all of the best plug-ins out there have been created by 1-2 people, with perhaps a couple graphics artists and other people.
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Mike Lee (Firebird)
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Originally posted by Firebird:
**...
So anyway...one other thing, regarding the mention of development teams. I know teamwork is a great thing and that the concept of a team is almost always a good one, for plug-in creation I don't know if I believe in a real team...
**
I would be glad to be shown that I am wrong, but to the best of my knowledge so far the various plug-in development teams have produced zilch. That is as far as completed, publicly available, playable plugs; there are plenty of bits and pieces and almost theres floating around, but no finished products. This is not to say it can't happen or won't happen, but history is against a team actually completing a plug.
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Joe Burnette
"I find that humans can be divided into only two meaningful categories: Decent Humans and Sonsofbitches; both types appear to be evenly distributed
among all shapes, colors, sizes, and nationalities." -- Keith Laumer
Quote
Originally posted by Joe Burnette:
I would be glad to be shown that I am wrong, but to the best of my knowledge so far the various plug-in development teams have produced zilch. That is as far as completed, publicly available, playable plugs; there are plenty of bits and pieces and almost theres floating around, but no finished products. This is not to say it can't happen or won't happen, but history is against a team actually completing a plug.
I agree about the team thing. I mean, c'mon, look at ATMOS -- they have yet to complete a single plugin. 
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(url="http://"http://www.evula.com/")EVula,(/url) your friendly (url="http://"http://www.evula.com/")self-promoting(/url) EV & EVO Boards/Addon/Newswire/Chronicles moderator
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Quote
Originally posted by EVula:
**I agree about the team thing. I mean, c'mon, look at ATMOS -- they have yet to complete a single plugin.;)
**
Correct.
They produced a new version of the game, not a plug-in - and with a certain amount of outside assistance to boot. Any other nominations?
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Joe Burnette
"I find that humans can be divided into only two meaningful categories: Decent Humans and Sonsofbitches; both types appear to be evenly distributed
among all shapes, colors, sizes, and nationalities." -- Keith Laumer
My friend Lord Asriel and I are already working on developing a TC plugin which will port EV to EVN. It's called EV:Quasar (well, Escape Velocity: Quasar Expansion is the full name for those detail-orientated people ;)), and should be out in a month or two (or three if we get really badly delayed). It will also include a few modifications here and there, and will hopefully be quite successful. Many graphics will be improved, and possibly some sounds will be added as well. Wish us luck!
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If at first you don't succeed...Hit it harder! - Me
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Millennium. Its coming, prepare for it.
Coming to the (url="http://"http://www.ambrosiaSW.com/games/ev/chronicles.html")EV Chronicles(/url).
I have to agree with Joe Burnette on that. I was, actually, going to become a part of the EV: Quasar project, but (apologies, Carnotaur) it quickly came to my attention that working in a team would limit each person's ideas and also make it more difficult to complete the project, as the members would spend most of the time talking about the plug-in instead.
Instead, I'll be working on a seperate project. My intentions are (with permission) to use MAGMA graphics for EV, although I seriously doubt running lights will be involved. The main improvement over the original EV will be full use of the Nova engine, and a totally new storyline to go with it. You've played Confederation, you've played Rebellion, but have you played the side that will ultimately overthrow them both? ; )
As you can expect, I intend to make this on my own, other than a heck of a lot of advice and some tips from respected people (if I actually know any :p) and some beta testing after. Then again, when I say beta testing, what I mean is I personally play the entire game a few times, searching for bugs, and then send it to some "beta testers" to tell me how perfect it is. <whistles>
Carno; first one to publish!
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-Lyat Esponer Corsair
I have a really neat idea for an EVN plug that's probably worthy of Frandall, it's so evil. Unfortunately, there's no way I have anything like the graphical ability to even think about doing a TC plug for Nova. :frown: The problem with doing plugs for Nova is that while the engine is great, the bar for graphics is extremely restrictive, to the point where a professional 3D modelling program and the skill to use it is virtually a requirement. Maybe if I collaborated full time with Skyblade or Clueless or someone like that, it could happen. Dunno.
/me wanders back to his Alien plug for EV in the meantime
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- Macavenger | e-mail: (url="http://"mailto:e-gamerguy1@attbi.com")mailto:e-gamerguy1@attbi.com(/url)e-gamerguy1@attbi.com
I don't think that you would need to have awesome drop-dead gorgeous graphics for a Nova TC, because there wouldn't be any standouts. As long as the graphics are at least good, and there aren't any that stand out in being particularly good or bad, then graphics wise it will be good. In that sense, it is easier to do a TC.
Quote
Originally posted by spl-cadet:
I don't think that you would need to have awesome drop-dead gorgeous graphics for a Nova TC, because there wouldn't be any standouts. As long as the graphics are at least good, and there aren't any that stand out in being particularly good or bad, then graphics wise it will be good. In that sense, it is easier to do a TC.
Perhaps, but there's no way I'm going to be able to use most of the stuff available in the shän resource. Banking graphics are a possibility, but I don't think I really have the capability to do engine glows, running lights, etc. it would look kinda watered down in comparison with what the game could do, and perhaps more importantly, I wouldn't be happy with it without those kind of things. I'm something of a perfectionist, which I know isn't always good, but it's still a fact.
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- Macavenger | e-mail: (url="http://"mailto:e-gamerguy1@attbi.com")mailto:e-gamerguy1@attbi.com(/url)e-gamerguy1@attbi.com
Yeah, Macavenger, I feel the same way. If I tried to make graphics for a Nova TC, I could never be happy with it. For that reason I am probably never going to get involved in a large plug-in effort unless I (or we) can get a skilled graphics artist to make them or just use some pre-made graphics. I think Pale used a lot of graphics that were downloaded from sites that offer free ship sets (didn't it?) and it was one of the greatest EV plug-ins.
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--ares
"You have not converted a man because you have silenced him."
-John Morley
To me, good graphics aren't essential to a good plug-in -- they just help to make a plug-in look better and perhaps separate the excellent from the awesome or the awesome from the kickass. I mean, take a look at the Frozen Heart, or the EVO graphics...as long as your ships resemble ships, as long as the rest of the plug-in's good, it'll be a great plug-in.
As far as the future of the old engine is concerned, I figure it's still far easier to get plug-ins to completion with the old stuff. I've started something for EVO, and though it might still end up being vaporware, it's got a better chance than if I did it for Nova.
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Mike Lee (Firebird)
Quote
Originally posted by Firebird:
To me, good graphics aren't essential to a good plug-in -- they just help to make a plug-in look better and perhaps separate the excellent from the awesome or the awesome from the kickass. I mean, take a look at the Frozen Heart, or the EVO graphics...as long as your ships resemble ships, as long as the rest of the plug-in's good, it'll be a great plug-in.
True, but you have to be happy with your own work, or there isn't a lot of point, is there? I'm not going to try to match the graphics quality of Nova or anything hopeless like that, but I would certainly like to be able to do engine glows and running lights at least.
Quote
Originally posted by Firebird:
As far as the future of the old engine is concerned, I figure it's still far easier to get plug-ins to completion with the old stuff. I've started something for EVO, and though it might still end up being vaporware, it's got a better chance than if I did it for Nova.
Quite true, though the extra tools available in Nova... 
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- Macavenger | e-mail: (url="http://"mailto:e-gamerguy1@attbi.com")mailto:e-gamerguy1@attbi.com(/url)e-gamerguy1@attbi.com
I know this isn't on topic, but being the unregistered user that I am (Thank you very much Ambrosia for letting me not register), I need to post somewhere.
I can't find a plug-in called Final Battle v.3.0 (I don't know if there's an update past that)
- it's approx. 4 megs
- it has about 40 new ships
- it's dang cool!
anyway, I'm already bored with Nova. It has many faults, but I won't say them because I might sound hypocritical since I can't barely even start making my own game, let alone one as awesome as the Escape Velocity trilogy. I hope someone can help me find the plug-in. I was in the mood for some classic EV, and this is my fav. plug-in, but my stupid brother threw it away two weeks ago. (He said he was conserving space... it takes up 4 megs, and we still have 20 gigs left. stupid. He deserved the punch he got)
On Topic now, Star Wars is an awesome topic to use for Escape Velocity, but there's already a whole discussion for that in the EVN webboard.
thanks
Stinky Diver (Who looks forward to good total conversion plug-ins for E.V.)
