Okay, it's Kane O'Donnell here (I wrote EVOGod and The Docks) , I know I haven't been 'with it' for a long, long time and I probably p*&sed; off a lot of people when I didn't finish EVOGod, but hey, I was only 17 and I was going into Year 12 and needed to concentrate on Rowmaster, my major project in software for that year. Anyway...

I'm finished 1st year of Uni, I have nothing to do for 12 weeks, and I have significantly improved my programming skills since my last releases. I would like to make a total EVN editor, from the ground up, OS X, Cocoa/Obj-C++.

I want to find out whether I have decent support for this. Is NovaTools just too useful to bother making a standalone editor? What do people want in a standalone? Don't say being able to import things from an Excel File, I tried that in EVOGod and it wasn't pretty, although maybe I could implement something similar for XML, hehe I could call it NovaXML...

What do the people want?

Cheers,

Kane O'Donnell

All I really want is a Carbon/Cocoa editor. NovaTools is great--the only drawback I can really find is that I have to boot up Classic to work on my plug.

So, if you could make something NovaTools-ish that runs in X I would be happy.

Oh, and welcome back.

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Don't bother making it for OS9, although ou may haave implied that.

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I'm sorry to burst your bubble , but AriosSotware is already doing this. And we are in beta stage already. For info look here : (url="http://"http://www.ariossoftware.com/upcoming/")EVONE(/url)
I will post a topic to annouce this(again) soon. EVONE will go far beyond novatools !!! With EVONE you'll be able to make ev(o) plugins too! EVONE can even render a system without starting up nova(of course it will do more that that) and will be fully functional in both OSX as OS9. To warm you up here is a little pic :

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(url="http://"http://www.apple.com")iMac, Therefore, I am(/url)
(url="http://"http://www.ariossoftware.com/upcoming/")EVONE 1.0.0, the plugin editor for EV/EVO/EVN(/url)
(url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/webboard/Forum26/HTML/007795.html")Star Trek : Frontiers ( An EVN Tc)(/url)
Somewhere out there life is bound to exist...

Yes, but the more apps, the more plug-ins. It's good to have many different editors, thus when someone doesn't like this one, they may like another one.
But yes, when EVONE doesn't have the quircky bugs, it'll be quite good.

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"psychologists are usually evil minions of Satan bent in defining you into a hole" -- from the #ev3 book of wisdom. (Lobster)

Quote

Originally posted by no_use_for_a_name:
Don't bother making it for OS9, although ou may haave implied that.

I'm not sure I can agree with that; while Mac OS X is indeed the future, there are still a number of people working in the past. I'm still actively supporting MissionComputer not only for Mac OS 9 but also for 68K-based Macs, and I've been in touch with people who need to run it on a 640x480 monitor.

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David Arthur @ (url="http://"http://davidarthur.evula.net/")davidarthur.evula.net(/url)
As Roosevelt said, there is nothing worse than the fear of fear. - (url="http://"http://pm.gc.ca/")Jean Chrétien(/url)
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last I heard, EVONE wasn,t free. Or am I wrong (WOULDN'T SUPRISE ME). A free editor would be cool.

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It's shareware. What ever happened to NovaBurst?

So far, there is NovaTools, EVONE, MC, NovaBurst, and now, NovaGod. Good competition... That makes for better programs.

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Quote

Originally posted by Galayon:
**last I heard, EVONE wasn,t free. Or am I wrong (WOULDN'T SUPRISE ME). A free editor would be cool.

**

EVONE is ONLY 10$ , you get a lot for 10$ !!!!

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(url="http://"http://www.apple.com")iMac, Therefore, I am(/url)
(url="http://"http://www.ariossoftware.com/upcoming/")EVONE 1.0.0, the plugin editor for EV/EVO/EVN(/url)
(url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/webboard/Forum26/HTML/007795.html")Star Trek : Frontiers ( An EVN Tc)(/url)
Somewhere out there life is bound to exist...

Yes, NovaGod would probably be free, because I made The Docks and EVOGod shareware and only 1 person out of 16000 people decided it was worth paying the fee, so I framed the cheque and decided shareware wasn't my business...

I suppose I put too much faith in the system : )

Oh well, passwords annoy me. Anyway, yes I am quite aware that EVONE is happening, but that never stopped me releasing EVOGod with EV-Edit as the hot thing!

A standalone program with an interface like NovaTools may be a good idea for those who like NovaTools but don't want to bother starting up classic. I will have to ask the good Doctor for permission of course.

Anyway, there's no way it will work on OS 9, I'll be using Objective-C++, integrating both Carbon and Cocoa, and the Cocoa runtime environment is OS X only. Sorry!

Cheers,

Kane O'Donnell

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Kane O'Donnell

Quote

Originally posted by Galayon:
A free editor would be cool.

Currently the plan is for MissionComputer 2.0 to continue the tradition of being available for free.

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David Arthur @ (url="http://"http://davidarthur.evula.net/")davidarthur.evula.net(/url)
As Roosevelt said, there is nothing worse than the fear of fear. - (url="http://"http://pm.gc.ca/")Jean Chrétien(/url)
(url="http://"http://www.ev-nova.net/")EV-Nova.net(/url): Now offering private forums for plug-in developers - No Fees, No Ads
(url="http://"http://w00tware.ev-nova.net/")w00tWare(/url) Returns - Now Hosted on (url="http://"http://www.ev-nova.net/")EV-Nova.net(/url)!

EVONE is coming along quite well and various screenshots are available:
(url="http://"http://www.ariossoftware.com/upcoming/evone/screenshots/")http://www.ariossoft...ne/screenshots/(/url)
(url="http://"http://www.ariossoftware.com/pub/syst/")http://www.ariossoftware.com/pub/syst/(/url) (watch the movie!)

(url="http://"http://www.ariossoftware.com/pub/galaxy/")http://www.ariossoft...com/pub/galaxy/(/url)

These screenshots are slightly out-dated, but they are generally accurate. I will try to get some new ones up there.

I know everyone wishes it was free, but coding in Carbon C takes considerable time and effort (and I need to pay for my website). The reason I am doing it in C is it allows some advanced features, and Cocoa was not an option (people asked for OS 9 support). It also allows me to use the graphics engine that Nova's was based on, making EVONE the only third-party editor that can currently load Nova's RLE sprites.

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(url="http://"http://www.ariossoftware.com/upcoming")EVONE 1.0.0 - the plugin editor for EV/EVO/EVN(/url)

(This message has been edited by AriosSw (edited 11-25-2002).)

Quote

**

I know everyone wishes it was free, but coding in Carbon C takes considerable time and effort (and I need to pay for my website).**

mmm, EVONE is way worth 10$. and he does have to pay for the website...

But the more compition the better, just means the more fun it is to make them see the failer that they are...

God I need to stay away from the beer.

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Quote

Originally posted by shado83:
**
Yes, you're right, it does take time and effort, especially if you aren't using Cocoa, damn, I wouldn't want to have to call GetControlByID 600 times : )
**

Oh yeah, by now it is up to a couple thousand times!! Of course, it is better than GetDialogItem, from back in the pre-Appearance Manager days.

Quote

Originally posted by shado83:
**
Actually with the latest version of REALBasic you can probably load the RLE sprites, but I'm not even going to bother trying, I'm a C++ convertee now.

I'm planning to drop OS 9 support because I don't want to write 10000 lines of code just to handle the events, so I'm using Obj-C++.
**

Yeah, Carbon greatly improves things, but there is still a lot of event-handlers to write.

Quote

Originally posted by shado83:
**
I'm comfortable with competition, mate, relax. I program for fun, not for money. You don't need to keep reminding people how good EVONE is ; - )

In any case, if you're interested in making a total Obj-C++ port of EVONE, I'd do that too, I'm just going through a Cocoa phase, it's a cool system once you get the MVC relationships under control.
**

Yes, I am thinking of doing that someday and am trying to teach myself Cocoa. If you want to talk about that, email me privately (ariossw@mac.com).

Quote

Originally posted by shado83:
**
Anyway, I'm rambling. Keep the ideas coming, people. Today's question: Do you prefer a single integrated editor, or lots of little ones? Bear in mind, you couldn't work on the same plug in two different editors at the same time, but back when I was writing EVOGod a stack of people kept telling me to separate the editors.
**

Personally, I prefer integrated editors (double-clicking a system launches the system editor etc.) which is why I am writing EVONE that way. Why couldn't you work in more than one editor simultaneously? It shouldn't be too hard to have a multi-document interface so that the only thing governing the number of editors open is the available memory.

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(url="http://"http://www.ariossoftware.com/upcoming")EVONE 1.0.0 - the plugin editor for EV/EVO/EVN(/url)

Quote

Originally posted by shado83:
**.... EV-Edit ...
**

/Gasp!

And so i dont lose a nother karmapoint...

I want to see in a stand alone plugmaker
(list=1)
() No bugs
() Easy to use
() Free (if you can)
() You dont spend a month debugging what it did to your plug
(/list=a)

Thats my 2 Pennys
-----------
Unreal

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Quote

Originally posted by Unreal Centipede:
**
And so i dont lose a nother karmapoint...

I want to see in a stand alone plugmaker
(list=1)
() No bugs
() Easy to use
() Free (if you can)
() You dont spend a month debugging what it did to your plug
(/list=a)

**

Did you lose a point because you spelled Ambrosia wrong in your From line? : )

To stay on topic, I would have to say your list is easier said than done. EVONE will try to accomplish the first two, the third is inversely proportional to the first two, and the last one is based solely on the number of bugs in the app and the talent of the debugger!

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(url="http://"http://www.ariossoftware.com/upcoming")EVONE 1.0.0 - the plugin editor for EV/EVO/EVN(/url)

Quote

Originally posted by Jager:
**mmm, EVONE is way worth 10$. and he does have to pay for the website...

But the more compition the better, just means the more fun it is to make them see the failer that they are...

God I need to stay away from the beer.

**

Y'know, I've been hearing soooooo much about EVONE; now I finally see links to the site. Thanx, guys. BTW, Kane, don't give up... go and make the app. anything to have more variety and it's a good learning experience. I'm still in the beginning stages of learning C++ on my own, so itt'l be awhile before I get up the moxie to post any of my creations!

Jager, I stay away from LITE beer! Guinness does me wonders...

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(This message has been edited by chrisw357 (edited 11-27-2002).)

Quote

Originally posted by AriosSw:
**

Why couldn't you work in more than one editor simultaneously? It shouldn't be too hard to have a multi-document interface so that the only thing governing the number of editors open is the available memory.

**

No, that's not what I meant. I mean you can't have two separate programs opening the same file at the same time, so you couldn't run say, a ship-editing program simultaneously with a govt-editing program on the same plug, because it would be a big programming no-no - it comprimises file security.

Well I'm going to start playing around with the interface, and maybe post a quick prototype (with no functionality) to get some feedback. It might take a week.

Let the debugging continue...

Cheers!

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Kane O'Donnell

Quote

Originally posted by shado83:
**No, that's not what I meant. I mean you can't have two separate programs opening the same file at the same time, so you couldn't run say, a ship-editing program simultaneously with a govt-editing program on the same plug, because it would be a big programming no-no - it comprimises file security.

**

Ahhh, yes, I agree. I misunderstood, I thought you meant when it was a single app.

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(url="http://"http://www.ariossoftware.com/upcoming")EVONE 1.0.0 - the plugin editor for EV/EVO/EVN(/url)